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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
This problem, which I suspected was malware related, was first posted over in the "Security" forums. It was concluded that is was NOT a malware related and it was suggested I try over here, so here I am.

The background for my problem can be found here:

http://www.techsupportforum.com/f100/solved-suspicious-long-delay-after-boot-up-365370.html

The short version is:

A couple weeks ago (I've been trying to solve this problem for a long time now), when I boot XP Home all seems normal but for 15 minutes non of my AV stuff (Norton, SpyBot, etc.) will run.

More recently I've noticed I cannot run the dial-up connection to the 'net either. At times the START button on my task bar will not run either, although this is not a consistent case.

After 15 minutes though, the PC "burps", the screen refreshes and all is well. Anything that I had tried to run prior to the 15 minutes, suddenly it comes up as if just called.

The good folk on the Security forum (Thanks Iain!) had me uninstall Norton (ack!) and put in AVG Free instead. Okay, that has been okay and it does run at initial boot.

Since the problem began, I've also upgraded to SP-2 (which I've deliberately avoided for years, obviously) as a requirement to installing AVG Free.

Please note: I am on a slow dial-up but will undertake almost anything to clear this matter up. Not only is the problem a painful one but this PC is vital to me and my work. Also, I've been pretty good in the past about curing PC problems on my own, but this one stumps me and has my curiosity aroused.

Folks, I stand by for suggestions...

Regards,
Raymond
 

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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
Re: Suspicous long delay, with problems, after boot.

A little more information:

Prior to the 15 minute 'pause', certain features would not run, although they would 'come alive' after the 15 minute lag if I had tried to run them during that time.

These include:

Ad-Aware
Spybot
Dial-Up connection
Norton (since uninstalled per 'Security' forum instructions and replaced with AVG, with runs okay.)

I have noted that at times my 'Start' button, on the task bar, will not operate, although this seems to be a "sometimes" symptom.

During the first week or so of this problem, the dial-up connection did work, although, once connected, the Task Tray icon did not display.
 

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Re: Suspicous long delay, with problems, after boot.

Hello and welcome to TSF,

One reason the icon didnt show up after connecting to the internet because you need to put a checkmark (show icon when connected) under properties of the connection.

Have you run chkdsk?

start
run
type
cmd press ok
type
chkdsk /r (notice 1 space between k and /) press enter
Cannot lock current drive
it is busy
it will ask run chkdsk on next boot, type Y, now reboot pc.

please post back with results.
 

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Re: Suspicous long delay, with problems, after boot.

Hello Raymond

Also have a look for problems in Device Manager
Right click My Computer/Properties/Hardware/Device Manager
Any yellow splats?

Try updating your video drivers.

.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Re: Suspicous long delay, with problems, after boot.

Riskyone101: Yes, the Task Tray icon has been turned on, been that way for years and still in place.

I will try the chkdsk /r routine in a moment and post results.


Dunedin: No Yellow or Red markers in Device Manager. Video drivers were updated about 2 months ago but I can check again.


Speedster: PC specs below, if anybody wants other information, please ask. Yes, an older system but does all I need. This problem is especially vexing since this machine has been very faithful and trouble free.

OS Name Microsoft Windows XP Home Edition
Version 5.1.2600 Service Pack 2 Build 2600
OS Manufacturer Microsoft Corporation
System Name RIPCORD
System Manufacturer HP Pavilion 061
System Model DQ177A-ABA a450n
System Type X86-based PC
Processor x86 Family 15 Model 3 Stepping 3 GenuineIntel ~3000 Mhz
Processor x86 Family 15 Model 3 Stepping 3 GenuineIntel ~3000 Mhz
BIOS Version/Date American Megatrends Inc. 3.21, 2/4/2004
SMBIOS Version 2.3
Windows Directory C:\WINDOWS
System Directory C:\WINDOWS\system32
Boot Device \Device\HarddiskVolume2
Locale United States
Hardware Abstraction Layer Version = "5.1.2600.2180 (xpsp_sp2_rtm.040803-2158)"
User Name RIPCORD\Owner
Time Zone Central Daylight Time
Total Physical Memory 1,024.00 MB
Available Physical Memory 444.32 MB
Total Virtual Memory 2.00 GB
Available Virtual Memory 1.96 GB
Page File Space 1.66 GB
Page File C:\pagefile.sys
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Re: Suspicous long delay, with problems, after boot.

Dunedin: Checked video drivers, all are currently up to date.

Riskyone101: Results from Chkdsk below. Took me a while to find the log for it but...


Event Type: Information
Event Source: Winlogon
Event Category: None
Event ID: 1001
Date: 5/1/2009
Time: 2:22:37 PM
User: N/A
Computer: RIPCORD
Description:
Checking file system on C:
The type of the file system is NTFS.
Volume label is HP_PAVILION.

A disk check has been scheduled.
Windows will now check the disk.
Cleaning up minor inconsistencies on the drive.
Cleaning up 409 unused index entries from index $SII of file 0x9.
Cleaning up 409 unused index entries from index $SDH of file 0x9.
Cleaning up 409 unused security descriptors.
CHKDSK is verifying file data (stage 4 of 5)...
File data verification completed.
CHKDSK is verifying free space (stage 5 of 5)...
Free space verification is complete.

154292039 KB total disk space.
41323384 KB in 142343 files.
54148 KB in 10032 indexes.
0 KB in bad sectors.
236671 KB in use by the system.
65536 KB occupied by the log file.
112677836 KB available on disk.

4096 bytes in each allocation unit.
38573009 total allocation units on disk.
28169459 allocation units available on disk.

Internal Info:
60 87 02 00 3d 52 02 00 d4 78 03 00 00 00 00 00 `...=R...x......
b5 36 00 00 00 00 00 00 8b 03 00 00 00 00 00 00 .6..............
3c 9f 87 0b 00 00 00 00 40 ce 9e 84 00 00 00 00 <[email protected]
50 98 c8 0d 00 00 00 00 20 88 17 28 04 00 00 00 P....... ..(....
56 86 31 14 06 00 00 00 9c 84 61 e1 0a 00 00 00 V.1.......a.....
10 f6 d2 b2 00 00 00 00 28 3e 07 00 07 2c 02 00 ........(>...,..
00 00 00 00 00 e0 2d da 09 00 00 00 30 27 00 00 ......-.....0'..
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Re: Suspicous long delay, with problems, after boot.

5 days since any replies, so I hope somebody will see this...

Problem still exists. Tried to use the 'Bootvis' utility to get a handle on what was happening, but it never responded properly due to a "misconfiguration" event within the software itself.

Repeating what I have found before, using 'Event Viewer' (from Administrative Tools), are 4 error entries. Between the first pair and second pair of events is when the 15 minute lag occurs. I do not know these are a cause or only a symptom but I do not know how to investigate further.

Here are the four events:

Event Type: Error
Event Source: Service Control Manager
Event Category: None
Event ID: 7000
Date: 5/6/2009
Time: 7:35:52 AM
User: N/A
Computer: RIPCORD
Description:
The nVidia WDM Video Capture (universal) service failed to start due to the following error:
The service cannot be started, either because it is disabled or because it has no enabled devices associated with it.


Event Type: Error
Event Source: Service Control Manager
Event Category: None
Event ID: 7000
Date: 5/6/2009
Time: 7:35:52 AM
User: N/A
Computer: RIPCORD
Description:
The nVidia WDM A/V Crossbar service failed to start due to the following error:
The service cannot be started, either because it is disabled or because it has no enabled devices associated with it.


Event Type: Error
Event Source: Service Control Manager
Event Category: None
Event ID: 7022
Date: 5/6/2009
Time: 7:51:25 AM
User: N/A
Computer: RIPCORD
Description:
The Server service hung on starting.



Event Type: Error
Event Source: Service Control Manager
Event Category: None
Event ID: 7001
Date: 5/6/2009
Time: 7:51:25 AM
User: N/A
Computer: RIPCORD
Description:
The Computer Browser service depends on the Server service which failed to start because of the following error:
After starting, the service hung in a start-pending state.
 

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Re: Suspicous long delay, with problems, after boot.

Well, these errors are showing nVidia to be at fault.

I know you told me that your video drivers were up-to-date, but I think you should reinstall them, or go back to the previous version which worked well.

Download and install Driver Sweeper

Make sure you have the video drivers to reinstall

Uninstall the video drivers
Reboot

Run Driver Sweeper and remve all entries for nVidia video drivers

Reinstall the video drivers.

.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 · (Edited)
Re: Suspicous long delay, with problems, after boot.

Granted, the vid drivers appear to be at fault, although my concern was for the 'Server' service, which reported being hung on start up, although it didn't report on how long that time was. Anyway...

Downloaded "Driver Sweeper".
Checked and downloaded fresh set of video drivers. (Nvidia)
Uninstalled current Nvidia video drivers.
Rebooted in Safe Mode, per 'Driver Sweeper' recommendations.

At this point I did not wait for the 15 minute lag time to pass, which may be why...

Ran Driver Sweeper and tried to have it clean out the old Nvidia display stuff.
When asked to clean it was not able to due to "access denied" error, although it appeared to be pointing to an internal error, within itself. Also, it took forever to attempt anything and, having no idea what (if any) progress it was making, I simply had to wait until 10 minutes passed (arbitrary time on my part) before deciding it was done and closing the program.

Rebooted in normal mode.
Installed Nvidia drivers, which require a re-boot of course.

All back to normal, meaning the problem still exists.


Dunedin, is there a source I can look at for learning how to manage, trace, edit the 'Server' service? Is there perhaps a log of specific events, other than in 'Event Viewer' where I might get more detailed information?

At my wits end here, although I don't know if I'll point a gun at my head or the PC's...
 

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Re: Suspicous long delay, with problems, after boot.

The only way I know is to access Server service from Admin Tools/Services.

Scroll down to "Server" and make sure it is set to "Automatic" and started. To change the status, double click it.

.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Re: Suspicous long delay, with problems, after boot.

'Server' was already set to Automatic. I tried putting it on manual then re-booting. No change, still 15 minute lag.

I finally was able to find (Google) the same problem, which always referred to a MS document: http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;319127

The meat of the article reads:

"This issue may occur if the Spooler service tries to start before the Server service. This issue may occur if you installed either the Lexmark International Markvision (LexBce) service or the Hewlett-Packard JetAdmin port monitoring software on your computer. "

To the best of my knowledge, no Lexmark service has been added, though I'm still searching for it. This is an HP machine, but I've not located any 'JetAdmin' port monitoring thing on here either. (Any advise on how to do so would be appreciated!)

The 'cure' suggested involved a Registry edit, for the Spooler Services. This required adding a new value, but there was one already in place, by the same name, which had entirely different values. So I was unable to attempt that fix.

*sigh*
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Re: Suspicous long delay, with problems, after boot.

Printer(s) uninstalled. No change.

More symptoms:

PC clock hangs during the 15 minute lag, but catches up properly once the lag goes away.

Start menu, if accessed at the wrong moment, will lock up or become unavailable during the lag.

Windows Media Player (10) will not run.

Again, all becomes normal after 15 minutes.
(Assuming listening to "Radar Rider" can be considered normal...)


Do you know of an entry in the Registry, possibly for the Spool, that could change a 15 minute 'wait' period to something considerably less? I'm rather shooting in the dark here but normal approaches are not working for me on this problem.
 

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Re: Suspicous long delay, with problems, after boot.

Well, if you stop the Nvidia related services and every other application starting up at boot (apart from necessities to run Windows), what happens?

You have so many applications starting up at boot so much of the problem is that.

Also, run a checkup of your HDD. Run a HDD defragment and a typical HDD test (like CrystalDiskMark). A dying/old HDD will give huge boot delays when reading random files at the start because it will read them so darn slow.
 

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Re: Suspicous long delay, with problems, after boot.

You can try setting the Server service to restart under the recovery tab, first failure
drop down. According to http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/ms685939(VS.85).aspx the service has failed when it terminates without reporting the status of Service_stopped.

Can you check your c:\windows\minidump folder for any files created recently the date
is embedded in the file name. You can use the windbg program to debug the dumps if you have installed all the symbols and tables.
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/315263

The other thing you may try is to open task manager and end task on explorer.exe and
then use File, New Task, c:\windows\explorer to restart it and see if the lag goes away.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Re: Suspicous long delay, with problems, after boot.

Kalim, I will attempt a selective start-up, as you suggest. This will take a long time, since every boot will require that 15 minute lag, unless "something" actually cures it. (HA!) Please be aware though that this problem didn't get to this stage over time, it happened between one boot-up and the next. Yes, I do have a lot of applications and related items on here, it is an old machine and I use it heavily. However, I've also been careful about how things get loaded (well, when given the option to anyway) and try to delete old stuff at various times.

I look at Defraging the HD at regular intervals, but the latest peak show's that none is really needed, being 2% or less.


Worked4me, I will also try the Service service mod you suggest. As for the "explorer.exe...New Task" thing, I'm not sure how that changes things but will give it a try as well.

The minidump folder has only 2 files in it, both from 2007. I'll have to investigate the "windbg" program, once I find and d/l it, to make any good use of it.

Anybody, is there a recommended Registry Cleaner out there (free?) that will be worth getting a hold of? I have one utility "XP Utilities", which is a bit old, that claims there are over 200 bad entries. I'm not sure I trust it enough to delete the entries. Given enough time, I could trace each one down though, then delete I guess. Suggestions welcome on this.


Sorry for delays in responding, I REALLY appreciate the help! I do have kids and grandkids and other "life" things getting into my time stream though. grrr...
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Re: Suspicous long delay, with problems, after boot.

Kalim: I forgot to mention, here is the CrystalDiskMark report...

--------------------------------------------------
CrystalDiskMark 2.2 (C) 2007-2008 hiyohiyo
Crystal Dew World : http://crystalmark.info/
--------------------------------------------------

Sequential Read : 40.885 MB/s
Sequential Write : 39.410 MB/s
Random Read 512KB : 21.406 MB/s
Random Write 512KB : 29.733 MB/s
Random Read 4KB : 0.335 MB/s
Random Write 4KB : 1.285 MB/s

Test Size : 100 MB
Date : 2009/05/08 8:41:45

I have no reference so cannot tell if these are good or bad numbers (keeping in mind this is an older machine), but they appear okay at first glance.


Worked4me:

Attempted the "New Task" for explorer.exe in Task Manager, after stopping it first, both during and after the 15 minute lag period. In both cases I also tried re-booting. Sorry but no change again.

Server service, I cannot find the option for the 'first failure' settings. I'm sure I've seen it somewhere but cannot locate it. I looked at 'Administrative Tools' and MSCONFIG but didn't see it. Can you point me in the right direction?
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Re: Suspicous long delay, with problems, after boot.

Worked4me: Sorry but I cannot d/l the windbg symbols package, it is too large for this dial up to get a hold of. (My version would be almost 200 Mb) If you wish, I can attach the 2 mini-dump files that I do have but they are from 2007 and I do not believe they have any information relative to the current problem.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Re: Suspicous long delay, with problems, after boot.

Using 'Administrative Tools', I attempted to manually (visually) check which local Services start AFTER 15 minute lag passes. During lag, I listed Services by Status, then noted the change in order after 15 minutes. All the Services listed below are set for "Manual" start-up, yet after 15 minutes, they start with no interaction on my part.

Application Layer Gateway Service
Background Intelligent Transfer Service
COM+ Event System
Fast User Switching Compatibility
Network Connections
Network Location Awareness (NLA)
Remote Access Connection Manager
SSDP Discovery Service
Telephony
Terminal Services

**************

The Services listed below are all "Disabled" and do not start.

Alerter
Bonjour Service
BrSplService
ClipBook
Messenger
NetMeeting Remote Desktop Sharing
Network DDE
Network DDE DSDM
Remote Access Auto Connection Manager
Routing and Remote Access
UStorage Server Service
Wireless Zero Configuration
 
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