[atschamp]

Hi,

I am having great difficulty with all of my games lagging, including some that are extremely unplayable.

I'm running Windows XP SP 2
Intel P4 3.0ghz
2gb ram
Geforce 8800GT 512mb vid card
with plenty of free hard drive space.

I only upgraded my vid card this week from onboard radeon xpress 200 series 256mb.

Games such as F1 challenge 99-02, Need for Speed: Carbon, Tomb Raider Anniversary are playable but struggling with some lag at times - and this is with low graphics.

Games such as Test Drive Unlimited and Colin McRae DiRT are completely unplayable running at around 1 frame a second most of the time.

I ran some some 3d mark tests and every graphics card test gets great frame rates, and every cpu test gets very very poor frame rates.

I also ran some CPU test programs and the operations of my CPU seemed extremely slow for example the program 'CPUFreeBenchmark 2' took 121 seconds to complete its operations on my computer whereas a friend who has an AMD athlon 2600+ took only 55 seconds and another with a P4 3.4ghz took 45 seconds.

With all of that said, I assume its my CPU - however all of these tests also said my CPU is running at 2.998ghz or so...

any help/ ideas appreciated,

thanks.

 

[koala]

Hi, welcome to TSF

Whenever you upgrade from integrated to a proper graphics card, especially a high-end one like the 8800GT, your computer's power requirements increase. If the graphics card, hard drive or CPU aren't getting enough power, this can cause games to lag.

Copy down the details from the PSU label (make/model, total watts, amps for +3.3V, +5V and +12V). PCIE cards need at least 26 amps on the +12V line to run properly. If the PSU is the original one from when you had onboard graphics, then it probably only has about 18A/+12V.

Enter your full system specs into this power calculator and set Capacitor Aging to 25%. Click the Calculate button, then add 30% to the total to allow for PSU inefficiency. Post back with this figure and the PSU label details.

Do you have the latest chipset drivers, device drivers and DirectX installed?

Go to Start > Run > dxdiag > Display tab and run the 2 tests. Any problems listed in the Notes box?

Are you using the BIOS default/optimized settings or have you overclocked anything?

If you think the CPU is underperforming, check your computer's voltages and temperatures with PC Wizard at startup with no other programs running. Take with a screenshot from the 'Voltage, Temperature & Fans' window. Leave it open on the desktop and take another screenshot of PC Wizard during gameplay when it starts to lag by pressing alt-tab to switch back to the desktop. Post back with both screenshots so we can see how your system copes under stress.

 

[atschamp]

Hi Thanks for your reply and help...

I knew when I was buying this card that my power supply was only 400Watt and this card needed 450 watt minimum so I purchased a 500 Watt power supply and put it in at the same time as the card... its details are:

P4-500W
+3.3V 20.0A
+5V 28.0A
+12V 20.0A

I entered my specs into the power calculator and got 360Watts.. added the 30% for a total of 468 Watts

I have Direct X 9.0C and I couldnt find any updates to the drivers for the card...

Ran the Dxdiag and everything ran fine no notes...

I took Screen shots using the PC Wizard on boot.. after 15 minutes of play and after 2 hours of play of my tomb raider game that is laggy but playable... the voltages, temps, fans etc didn't change at all...


I just opened it up and made some adjustments with cables... maybe you can help me understand this better:

From my power supply I have power into my Dvd drive and it was shared with the splitter connection or wateva it is.. u know how they detach into 2 sections.. had it to 1 power connector of the vid card.. and another power into a secondary hdd and from it into the vid card.. as this was the only way to get power to all.. i figured since you think its a power problem that I would unplug the hdd.. put one into the dvd and the other both connections into the both connections of the card.. this seems to have improved 1 of my games.. i cant test the others as they are all on the secondary hdd... when i say improved tho.. it is still completely unplayable.. i tried it with colin mcrae dirt which barely moved before and now it would run at like 5-10 frames per second.. so this made some improvement... any other ideas?

 

[koala]

You've got enough watts to power the computer, but PCIE graphics cards need a minimum of 26A on the +12V line. Your PSU only has 20A, which would be enough for an AGP card, but not for a PCIE 8800GT.

The +12V line also powers the CPU, so this would explain the poor CPU test results.

Less than 26A doesn't cause too many problems when working on the 2D desktop, but going into 3D gaming mode can push the PSU, graphics card and cooling system to their limits, and if left for too long can cause permanent damage to your components.

Time for another replacement. Go for a good quality brand like Seasonic, Thermaltake or OCZ, not one of the cheaper brands like Rosewill. If you'd like us to make some recommendations, what is your price range and motherboard make/model, and do you have any preferences (modular, 20/4 power connectors, multiple PCIE connectors, etc)?

 

[atschamp]

How does this PSU look?

http://cgi.ebay.com.au/OCZ-StealthX...yZ111429QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem


I really have no experience with PSU's so your going to have to help me here a bit.... modular? 20/4 power connectors?

I only have the 1 pcie.. the graphics card, with its 2 connectors coming off it...

I assume the 20/4 are the power connections to the board? and my current PSU is 20/4 ...

do some PSUs come with extra connections? incase i put another hdd or something in... i assume this information in the link is what im looking for:

2 x PCI-E
6 x 4-pin peripheral
2 x 4-pin floppy
6 x S-ATA


is there specific power for PCI-E ??? because at the moment I have normal perpiheral power connections going into it???

 

[atschamp]

I understand the PCI-E connectors now.. ignore that lol..

another question though I found it hard to plug power into it because the pins are loose and have trouble lining up from the graphics card power connector.. and if you push too hard they fall out.. is this how it should be???

 

[koala]

The OCZ StealthXstream 600W is a good choice for the 8800GT, although the 700W version would give more headroom for future upgrades. This is the kind of quality and price range you need to be looking at for your computer to prevent power/heat problems.

Modular means you can disconnect and remove any of the power cables that you don't need, meaning less clutter inside the case, better airflow and hopefully lower temperatures.

20/4 means the PSU's main power connector can be used on a motherboard with either a 20 or a 24 pin connector by snapping off the extra 4pin section. It's just an extra feature that gives you more freedom.

is there specific power for PCI-E ??? because at the moment I have normal perpiheral power connections going into it???

You should be plugging the 6 pin PCIE power cable from the PSU into the back of your 8800GT. See pic below.

another question though I found it hard to plug power into it because the pins are loose and have trouble lining up from the graphics card power connector.. and if you push too hard they fall out.. is this how it should be???

No, it should be a firm connection with no movement. The connector should click and lock into position

 

[atschamp]

well the connector does lock into place.. but the actual connection from the graphics cards pins move around and its hard to line it up to get it to click into place.. but its firm when it does.. i just thought maybe it was faulty as they move around..

so you are 100% sure this is the problem.. its weird because there has been no overheating problems, the temperatures have never risen from startup to like 2-3 hours of gameplay as i descovered with pc wizard.

I guess it all makes sense though, I notice it ran worse with my wheel connected which would be draining more power.

I can't believe the graphics card came with instructions telling me to get a 450Watt power supply yet it didnt mention anything about +12v needing 26A .. so annoying as I went and bought this power supply specifically for this card and now I need to pay a heap more for a better one.. oh well.. thanks so much again for your help.. I guess I will go look for 700Watt.. that was the only one I could find on ebay of all the brands you mentioned for under 200 AUS dollars... so yeah its pretty expensive.. but I guess if i want it to work its what Ive gotta do..

Also... 700 Watt power supply wont affect my mboard will it? like it wont be too much?? my board is described as 'Intel D101GGC" in pc wizard 08

 

[koala]

There might be other problems as well that we can look at later, but a PSU with only 20A/+12V is not suitable for a PCIE card and needs to be replaced to prevent damage.

The recommendations you see in graphics card adverts saying you need a 450W PSU don't take into account the rest of your components and are only a guideline, although I can't understand why they never mention the amps required seeing as most people now use PCIE cards. The power calculator gives a more accurate figure.

Hang on for some more replies. We have a few Aussies on the hardware team who might be able to find you some good PSU deals locally.

EDIT:

Also... 700 Watt power supply wont affect my mboard will it? like it wont be too much?? my board is described as 'Intel D101GGC" in pc wizard 08

The computer will only use the power it needs, so you could put a compatible 1200W unit in and it wouldn't cause any problems.

 

[atschamp]

Ok thanks for that - it would be great if they could direct me to a good PSU and good price locally or at least in Australia...

for now while i wait though, it shouldnt do any damage if I use it like this for a few weeks should it? I guess the less of the games I play the better.. using it on the desktop etc would be fine I assume..?

Thanks again for your help, much appreciated

 

[koala]

Fullscreen 3D games will put the PSU under more stress than 2D desktop work, so I would keep gaming sessions as short as possible until you get the upgrade. We're usually quite quick with replies, so you should get some recommendations and links within the next couple of days.

If you would like an instant email notification when you get a reply, go to Thread Tools > Subscribe at the top of this page. Saves you logging in every few hours to check.

 

[atschamp]

I just noticed my old PSU the 400Watt had only 14A on the +12v line.. shouldnt this have affected the CPU back then?

 

[atschamp]

No one seems to be replying locally

Just 1 other question just to clarify... these specs are ok:

3.3v - 24A, 5v - 30A, 4x 12v - 18Aeach (56a total)

where there is more then 1 12v line with 18A on each.. that is ok still? As I have found a good priced Seasonic 700W with these specs and think I will get it if its ok..

thanks..

 

[koala]

Yes, that 700W PSU looks like it will be ok. Seasonic is one of the best brands. Multiple +12V rails are very common, so you'll be getting plenty of amps.

 

[atschamp]

Hey,

I bought a PC with a modular power supply and am confused as to how to get the card plugged in properly.. i thought i had it right.. it worked and found it before booting up windows.. then in windows i tried to install the drivers for it and it freezes the installation then windows wont boot up again until i put it in safe mode and restore point it.. tried this 3 or 4 times.. same result.

In the bios.. i get a warning...

Warning: VGA Graphics card is not guarenteed to operate normally...

any ideas?

My PSU is 1000W Cybersport ... with multi rails etc.
dual core 3.0ghz
2gb ddr2 ram..

etc..

I went and bought a whole new pc minus the card lol..

thanks again.

 

[koala]

Try resetting your BIOS to default, and if there's a Robust Graphics Booster (RGB) or MB Intelligent Tweaker (MIT) option, set it to Auto.

EDIT: To install the graphics driver, boot into Safe Mode, uninstall your current driver from Control Panel > Add/Remove Programs, reboot into Safe Mode again, disable antivirus, install the latest driver and reboot into Windows normal mode to complete.

 

[atschamp]

I have the MB intelligent tweaker and within that i have the robust graphics booster which is already set to auto.. it is within this menu that the warning sits..

i dont know how to reset the bios to default cant find it but i assume the settings are already default since i havent changed anything

im pretty sure that i have the card connected properly too btw..

 

[koala]

Are you using your existing hard drive with the new computer? If you are, did you reinstall XP? Windows doesn't like to be run on a different motherboard to the one it was originally installed on, and this can cause all kinds of problems.

 

[atschamp]

nah new hdd.. and the people i bought it off assembled it and installed windows too..

my display options in the bios are pci, peg, peg2, peg3 .. its set to peg could it be the others?

ive noticed not only the problem i described before about the lock up but its very slow e.g i open control panel and tried to drag the window and it lagged right across the screen.. so weird.....

 

[koala]

PEG is short for 'PCIE Graphics', so you're using the right one. It wouldn't do any harm to try PEG2 and 3 though.

The laggy movement on the desktop is because the correct graphics driver is not installed.

If the computer was built by someone else, they might have changed the BIOS settings. Can you contact them to ask about this? If not, check the motherboard manual. It will tell you how to reset the BIOS to default.