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This is a discussion on BSOD Kernel Dump Analysis - Discussion within the BSOD, App Crashes And Hangs forums, part of the Tech Support Forum category. ` For an execellent tutorial on getting started with BSOD Kernel Memory Dump Debugging, see POST #12 This is a


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Old 01-01-2010, 01:07 AM   #1
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`

For an execellent tutorial on getting started with BSOD Kernel Memory Dump Debugging, see POST #12

This is a discussion thread on debugging and analyzing Blue Screen of Death (BSOD) Kernel Memory Dumps.

All comments and questions are welcome - simply submit a reply post.

If you are seeking help for BSODs, please see --> BSOD Posting Instructions


Thank you all for your input.

Kind Regards. . .

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Old 01-16-2010, 08:43 PM   #2
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I have received > 1,000 PMs and emails about Blue Screen View. The following is my professional and personal opinion on the product.

I believe that Blue Screen View is a very good product; however, most often misses the very obvious and tell-tale signs that one sees in the debugger. Granted, most times these "obvious" signs that are obvious to me may be considered "buried" and not-so-obvious to others.

Bottom line, you cannot always rely on the line "Probably caused by", especially when it is encircled by other driver names. I am specifically referring to those dumps that give up Microsoft drivers as the probable cause, which in 99% of the cases is simply not true - this goes for BlueScreenView or the Windows Debugger.

One of my earliest tests of BlueScreenView - Caused By Driver : ntoskrnl.exe (NT).

BlueScreenView gave the blame to NT because it was the last on the stack - nt!

Code:
STACK_TEXT:  (edited)
00000000`00000000 : nt!PfFbLogEntryComplet
fffffa80`0907ab60 : nt!PfFileInfoNotify+0x
fffffa60`099ff430 : fileinfo!FIStreamLog+0
fffffa60`099ff430 : fileinfo!FIStreamSetFi
00000000`00003bd2 : fileinfo!FIStreamGetIn
00000000`00000000 : fileinfo!FIPostCreateC
fffffa80`07518b30 : fltmgr!FltpPerformPost
fffffa60`099ff620 : fltmgr!FltpLegacyProce
00000000`00000000 : fltmgr!FltpCreate+0x25
00000000`00000000 : AVGIDSFilter+0x54f0
fffffa80`04d64820 : 0x801
00000000`00000005 : 0x300
fffffa80`08ec2940 : 0xfffffa80`08ec2940

Windbg = Probably caused by : fileinfo.sys

Windbg gave p/cause to fileinfo.sys because it is the last subordinate MS driver to nt!

Both BlueScreenView and the Microsoft WHDC debugger were incorrect in the "probable cause" that each named, but Windbg came much closer to actual. Remember that we are given a probable cause - not the actual cause of a system crash.

Please don't get me wrong - I think Blue Screen View has done a great initial job. Like all software products, there is room for improvement; hence the reason they have asked for feedback. I wish that I could write an app that came close to BlueScreenView. I give the author(s) an A+ for initiative.

What I hate to see is someone using BlueScreenView and posting the results of 25 dumps all showing the NT Kernel (or other Microsoft driver) as the cause of the BSODs and considering it to be Gospel. NT may show up as the probable cause more often than any other; however --> Never happen. Not in a genuine Windows OS system.

What do you believe the cause of the crash to be? I have attached the dump, my Windbg log (partial) and the Blue Screen View HTML file.

WHDC/ WDK Debugging Tools For Windows --> https://www.microsoft.com/whdc/devtoo...g/default.mspx

PLEASE - feel free to comment in any manner in which you see fit.

Regards. . .

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Old 01-17-2010, 07:41 AM   #3
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Very interesting... I've never heard of Blue Screen View to be honest. I'm definitely more biased toward WinDbg; I've been using it since I started. But, yes, blaming nt is definitely misleading. It does put the information in a pretty nice interface, but it's not completely accurate.

WinDbg names fileinfo.sys as the probable cause, which is a driver that comes preloaded with the OS. I always look to the stack text for more information:
Code:
fffffa60`099fdf88 fffff800`020a33ee nt!KeBugCheckEx
fffffa60`099fdf90 fffff800`020a2dbc nt!KiBugCheckDispatch+0x6e
fffffa60`099fe0d0 fffff800`020b69cd nt!KiSystemServiceHandler+0x7c
fffffa60`099fe110 fffff800`020bdfef nt!RtlpExecuteHandlerForException+0xd
fffffa60`099fe140 fffff800`0207bda3 nt!RtlDispatchException+0x22f
fffffa60`099fe830 fffff800`020a34a9 nt!KiDispatchException+0xc3
fffffa60`099fee30 fffff800`020a22a5 nt!KiExceptionDispatch+0xa9
fffffa60`099ff010 fffff800`0213bdb9 nt!KiPageFault+0x1e5
fffffa60`099ff1a0 fffff800`021719b4 nt!PfFbLogEntryComplete+0x9
fffffa60`099ff1d0 fffffa60`00a5b4f9 nt!PfFileInfoNotify+0x654
fffffa60`099ff250 fffffa60`00a5bb2c fileinfo!FIStreamLog+0x89
fffffa60`099ff320 fffffa60`00a5b36c fileinfo!FIStreamSetFileInfo+0x14c
fffffa60`099ff390 fffffa60`00a59c16 fileinfo!FIStreamGetInfo+0x17c
fffffa60`099ff410 fffffa60`00a0ff0c fileinfo!FIPostCreateCallback+0x17a
fffffa60`099ff490 fffffa60`00a0df5d fltmgr!FltpPerformPostCallbacks+0x31d
fffffa60`099ff560 fffffa60`00a2a26c fltmgr!FltpLegacyProcessingAfterPreCallbacksCompleted+0x36d
fffffa60`099ff5d0 fffffa60`088a24f0 fltmgr!FltpCreate+0x25d
fffffa60`099ff680 00000000`00000801 AVGIDSFilter+0x54f0
fffffa60`099ff688 00000000`00000300 0x801
fffffa60`099ff690 fffffa80`08ec2940 0x300
AVG is listed at the bottom of the stack. So, am I right in saying that AVG caused it...? Please?
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Old 01-17-2010, 01:25 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DT Roberts View Post
Very interesting... I've never heard of Blue Screen View to be honest. I'm definitely more biased toward WinDbg; I've been using it since I started. But, yes, blaming nt is definitely misleading. It does put the information in a pretty nice interface, but it's not completely accurate.

WinDbg names fileinfo.sys as the probable cause, which is a driver that comes preloaded with the OS. I always look to the stack text for more information:
Code:
fffffa60`099fdf88 fffff800`020a33ee nt!KeBugCheckEx
fffffa60`099fdf90 fffff800`020a2dbc nt!KiBugCheckDispatch+0x6e
fffffa60`099fe0d0 fffff800`020b69cd nt!KiSystemServiceHandler+0x7c
fffffa60`099fe110 fffff800`020bdfef nt!RtlpExecuteHandlerForException+0xd
fffffa60`099fe140 fffff800`0207bda3 nt!RtlDispatchException+0x22f
fffffa60`099fe830 fffff800`020a34a9 nt!KiDispatchException+0xc3
fffffa60`099fee30 fffff800`020a22a5 nt!KiExceptionDispatch+0xa9
fffffa60`099ff010 fffff800`0213bdb9 nt!KiPageFault+0x1e5
fffffa60`099ff1a0 fffff800`021719b4 nt!PfFbLogEntryComplete+0x9
fffffa60`099ff1d0 fffffa60`00a5b4f9 nt!PfFileInfoNotify+0x654
fffffa60`099ff250 fffffa60`00a5bb2c fileinfo!FIStreamLog+0x89
fffffa60`099ff320 fffffa60`00a5b36c fileinfo!FIStreamSetFileInfo+0x14c
fffffa60`099ff390 fffffa60`00a59c16 fileinfo!FIStreamGetInfo+0x17c
fffffa60`099ff410 fffffa60`00a0ff0c fileinfo!FIPostCreateCallback+0x17a
fffffa60`099ff490 fffffa60`00a0df5d fltmgr!FltpPerformPostCallbacks+0x31d
fffffa60`099ff560 fffffa60`00a2a26c fltmgr!FltpLegacyProcessingAfterPreCallbacksCompleted+0x36d
fffffa60`099ff5d0 fffffa60`088a24f0 fltmgr!FltpCreate+0x25d
fffffa60`099ff680 00000000`00000801 AVGIDSFilter+0x54f0
fffffa60`099ff688 00000000`00000300 0x801
fffffa60`099ff690 fffffa80`08ec2940 0x300
AVG is listed at the bottom of the stack. So, am I right in saying that AVG caused it...? Please?



`

You got it, Devin !

The AVG driver AVGIDSFilter.sys is the culprit.

Nice!

John

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Old 01-17-2010, 02:38 PM   #5
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I just wondered about the difference in your debug stack list and Devon's.
Can I assume that yours was shorthand?
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Old 01-17-2010, 08:49 PM   #6
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`

The stack from my attached log - post #1 -
Code:

STACK_TEXT:  
fffffa60`099ff1a0 fffff800`021719b4 : 00000000`0000003f fffffa60`099ff280 00000000`00000001 00000000`00000000 : nt!PfFbLogEntryComplete+0x9
fffffa60`099ff1d0 fffffa60`00a5b4f9 : 00000000`00000000 fffff880`000e5d08 fffffa60`099ff358 fffffa80`0907ab60 : nt!PfFileInfoNotify+0x654
fffffa60`099ff250 fffffa60`00a5bb2c : fffffa80`074cb670 fffff880`08fd29f0 fffffa60`099ff430 fffffa60`099ff430 : fileinfo!FIStreamLog+0x89
fffffa60`099ff320 fffffa60`00a5b36c : fffff880`08fd29f0 00000000`00000000 fffffa60`099ff430 fffffa60`099ff430 : fileinfo!FIStreamSetFileInfo+0x14c
fffffa60`099ff390 fffffa60`00a59c16 : fffff100`15e10e67 00000000`00000001 00000000`00000000 00000000`00003bd2 : fileinfo!FIStreamGetInfo+0x17c
fffffa60`099ff410 fffffa60`00a0ff0c : fffffa80`04d647d8 fffffa60`099ff4d8 fffff880`08fd29f0 00000000`00000000 : fileinfo!FIPostCreateCallback+0x17a
fffffa60`099ff490 fffffa60`00a0df5d : fffffa80`04bdb030 fffffa80`04f87a20 fffffa80`07518910 fffffa80`07518b30 : fltmgr!FltpPerformPostCallbacks+0x31d
fffffa60`099ff560 fffffa60`00a2a26c : fffffa80`074cbde0 fffffa80`074cb670 fffffa80`04d64400 fffffa60`099ff620 : fltmgr!FltpLegacyProcessingAfterPreCallbacksCompleted+0x36d
fffffa60`099ff5d0 fffffa60`088a24f0 : 00000000`00000801 00000000`00000300 fffffa80`08ec2940 00000000`00000000 : fltmgr!FltpCreate+0x25d
fffffa60`099ff680 00000000`00000801 : 00000000`00000300 fffffa80`08ec2940 00000000`00000000 00000000`00000000 : AVGIDSFilter+0x54f0
fffffa60`099ff688 00000000`00000300 : fffffa80`08ec2940 00000000`00000000 00000000`00000000 fffffa80`04d64820 : 0x801
fffffa60`099ff690 fffffa80`08ec2940 : 00000000`00000000 00000000`00000000 fffffa80`04d64820 00000000`00000005 : 0x300
fffffa60`099ff698 00000000`00000000 : 00000000`00000000 fffffa80`04d64820 00000000`00000005 fffffa80`08ec2940 : 0xfffffa80`08ec2940
`
SCROLL to the right in the code box above and you'll see the edited stack below as was displayed in my 1st post. I simply block-deleted several of the (hex #) columns except for the last -
Code:
STACK_TEXT:  (edited)
00000000`00000000 : nt!PfFbLogEntryComplet
fffffa80`0907ab60 : nt!PfFileInfoNotify+0x
fffffa60`099ff430 : fileinfo!FIStreamLog+0
fffffa60`099ff430 : fileinfo!FIStreamSetFi
00000000`00003bd2 : fileinfo!FIStreamGetIn
00000000`00000000 : fileinfo!FIPostCreateC
fffffa80`07518b30 : fltmgr!FltpPerformPost
fffffa60`099ff620 : fltmgr!FltpLegacyProce
00000000`00000000 : fltmgr!FltpCreate+0x25
00000000`00000000 : AVGIDSFilter+0x54f0
fffffa80`04d64820 : 0x801
00000000`00000005 : 0x300
fffffa80`08ec2940 : 0xfffffa80`08ec2940
`

Look for the k command in the debugger.chm help file. Usually, kd is used.

Regards. . .

John

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Old 01-17-2010, 09:07 PM   #7
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And, for a more simplified view without the memory addresses, use the kc command:
Code:
2: kd> kc
Call Site
nt!KeBugCheckEx
nt!KiBugCheckDispatch
nt!KiSystemServiceHandler
nt!RtlpExecuteHandlerForException
nt!RtlDispatchException
nt!KiDispatchException
nt!KiExceptionDispatch
nt!KiPageFault
nt!PfFbLogEntryComplete
nt!PfFileInfoNotify
fileinfo!FIStreamLog
fileinfo!FIStreamSetFileInfo
fileinfo!FIStreamGetInfo
fileinfo!FIPostCreateCallback
fltmgr!FltpPerformPostCallbacks
fltmgr!FltpLegacyProcessingAfterPreCallbacksCompleted
fltmgr!FltpCreate
AVGIDSFilter
0x0
0x0
There are TONS of switches for the k command (k, kv, kv, kc, kn, and so much more), all displaying different types and amounts of info. Go through sometime and find what you like best.
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Old 01-17-2010, 09:44 PM   #8
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I see what you guys are saying in both outputs.

What I looked at without running DBG was in Johns first post and the text file that was used.
It may be a local problem for me as I cant reproduce it, even with copy and paste.

I see one line in the stack with no address references.
I have enclosed a txt file to see what I am talking about,
Attached Files
File Type: txt New Text Document (2).txt (812 Bytes, 260 views)
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Old 01-18-2010, 03:55 AM   #9
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From your attachment - edited for display purposes (I deleted most of the columns to the left) -
Code:

 fffffa60`099ff620 : fltmgr!FltpLegacyProcessingAfterPreCallbacksCompleted+0x36d
 00000000`00000000 : fltmgr!FltpCreate+0x25d
 00000000`00000000 : AVGIDSFilter+0x54f0
 fffffa80`04d64820 : 0x801
 00000000`00000005 : 0x300
 fffffa80`08ec2940 : 0xfffffa80`08ec2940
`

AVGIDSFilter is the culprit as we now know.

As for the 0x801 & 0x300 - not sure of their meaning as we only have a mini kernel memory dump file to work with v. a full kernel dump.

0xfffffa80`08ec2940 = a memory address that is not identifiable. A full kernel dump may be able to tell us what the object is residing at that address; however, we may also need the page file to convert the address to/from virtual address/ physical memory address.

Regards. . .

JC

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@ DT Roberts - Devin, thank you for further explaining the k command. Using kc would save me a step or two!

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Old 01-24-2010, 08:35 AM   #10
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Sorry for being late to the party, but here's my 2 :0)

There isn't any tool that will always tell you what to fix with a BSOD. This is the reason we need analysts.

For the simplest (so to speak) cases - when a BSOD blames NTOSKRNL.EXE, it just can't be that. If it was, the OS would have lot's of other problems (other than just the occasional BSOD).

Add to this the Windows System File Checker's protection, and it makes the Windows files even less likely to be at fault. BUT, this doesn't completely rule them out - it just decreases the likelyhood that Windows will be at fault.

I use BlueScreenView on all the dump files that I analyze.
Most often I'll find that it will pickup different files than WinDbg - and will list different drivers in the stack text.

Although I have no clue why it's listing what it does, I can't see just throwing the data out. So I remember the data while analyzing crash dumps.

Quite often I don't need the results, but sometimes it'll clue me in to something that isn't obvious or that I'd miss otherwise. Most recently this was an issue with Kaspersky Internet Security that wasn't present in the WinDbg output.

*****************************************************************

The more time that you spend analyzing memory dump files, the more you'll realize that there's a lot more to learn!

Take a look around the web for people doing BSOD analysis. You'll find that there just aren't that many people using WinDbg in order to help out users with their BSOD's.

I started out doing BSOD analysis by reading the descriptions of the BSOD's at https://aumha.org/a/stop.htm (it hasn't been updated since 2007, so I made up this table to be used instead: https://www.carrona.org/bsodindx.html ) and seeing what parts of the errors corresponded to what the user was describing. You can do a lot with just that information and a Google search. And that will help to improve your search skills - another essential tool in your arsenal.

The next step was to actually read the dump files using WinDbg (and to read up on other things like Debugging Techniques, Windows Internals, and programming). Then things start to become a bit clearer - but it's a lot of work (and it's where we lose a lot of people who aspire to analyze BSOD's). Also, there's a lot that you won't understand on the first read - so reread them all periodically. You'll be amazed at how much more you understand each time! I'm on my 3rd read-through of Windows Internals, 5th Edition and my 2nd read-through of Advanced Windows Debugging.

Again, don't just accept what the tools give you. Do research on the results to find out why these things happen. It's understanding the "why" of these things that makes a good analyst.


Finally, I really want to thank all of your for your dedication to helping others - and especially by doing it in this extremely difficult area. You show me (and others) the true spirit of the online communities - "Users helping users"
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Old 01-31-2010, 02:03 AM   #11
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I would hardly appreciate a tool which tells me the actual cause of any bsod :D
...especially as BluescreenView always tells me that ntoskrnl.exe is the cause.
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Old 03-13-2010, 05:02 AM   #12
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Not even Debugging Tools for Windows will provide you with an actual cause.... only the probable cause.

BlueScreenView does seem to favor blaming the NT Kernel for all, doesn't it?

The best beginner's tutorial for debugging authored by the great H2SO4 -->

https://www.vistax64.com/tutorials/22...k-process.html

Regards. . .

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Old 03-20-2010, 07:39 AM   #13
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Guys

Just wanted to say thanks for the most thorough description I have seen to date. Information like this helps people new to debugging.

Ken
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Old 03-20-2010, 10:19 AM   #14
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Kudos for the info John !!

- Captain
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Old 03-20-2010, 10:34 AM   #15
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yes thnx guys it does slowly become clearer especially revisiting many of the excellent answers you have taken the care to publish and explain
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Old 03-20-2010, 04:48 PM   #16
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Feels like old home week. Usamsa, jcgriff, dtroberts, ickmay, capt jack S, etc. Seems like we have moved en masse.

Ken
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Old 03-21-2010, 01:56 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zigzag3143 View Post
Feels like old home week. Usamsa, jcgriff, dtroberts, ickmay, capt jack S, etc. Seems like we have moved en masse.

Ken
no I just come here for a holiday, sit round a campfire and toast marshmallows while i watch jcgriff debug peoples .dmp files

I exist on three forums
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Old 03-21-2010, 06:25 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ickymay View Post
no I just come here for a holiday, sit round a campfire and toast marshmallows while i watch jcgriff debug peoples .dmp files

I exist on three forums
JC isn't alone on here!
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Old 03-21-2010, 01:07 PM   #19
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There just aren't that many people who help users with memory dumps.
There's also not much reward for doing it - so it takes a special kind of person to do this (relatively) thankless task.

Search for BSOD threads on the web - there's just not that many people who can use the Debugging Tools to analyze a dump file (to help a user - developers are another story). Right now it's probably limited to just those mentioned in this thread.

Thanks to all of you who devote your time to helping others!!!
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Old 03-21-2010, 03:44 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ickymay View Post
yes thnx guys it does slowly become clearer especially revisiting many of the excellent answers you have taken the care to publish and explain
Stick around...
It is getting to be more clear for myself,as well
We all learn from each other....
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