Engineer Babar

I am doing bachelors in Engineering.. The college is in my homeland Pakistan..

But why?? Can I know??

Thanks..

Lord Sirian

To me, the war in the Middle East is utterly meaningless. I didn't support America's invasion after September 11 and I don't support it any more today than I did back then. That's why I'm glad that most (if not all) of Australia's troops will soon be recalled. At least... That's what the politicians say, so who knows..?

Oh and I'd like to express my feelings about this statement.

I think it's probably safe to say that just about any nation with nuclear weapons is able to do what you have said there, and more. What most nations fail to realise is that NUKES ARE BAD. I for one am proud of Australia for remaining a nuclear-weapon-free nation. There is no victory for anybody when it comes to nuclear weapons. Any nuclear strike, or even carpet bombing of a whole country, would basically result in the complete devastation of all parties, even America. Nukes do not make you invincible.

Engineer Babar

you99

Don't be so proud. russia was also a superpower before entering afghanistan

djaburg

My comment was to make a point and it was to illustrate that despite what COULD be done, it isn't. Our military uses every technological resource to reduce the number of innocent lives lost during a conflict. If you didn't understand that, then you didn't read it correctly.

As for Russia, they rotted from within because they were a coummunist nation that crumbled from within. they didn't fail as a nation as a result of going in to Afghanistan.

Lord Sirian

Sorry, but that argument really holds no sway with me. Yes it COULD be done, but if America were to destroy an entire country then I don't think it would be too long before other countries started retaliating. And no matter how powerful a country is, just a handful of nukes from any other country can reduce it to rubble very quickly.

djaburg

What holds no sway with you?

Lord Sirian

To me, that is a load of rubbish, and the only motive for it is self preservation.

djaburg

It's rubbish? Well that's your opinion and you're certainly entitled to it. I served in the military for 10 years and I do understand how it functions. As I said in my earlier post what COULD be done versus what is being done is completely different. When we're constantly being accused of things like carpet bombing (which started this line of comment) I felt the need to clarify that carpet bombing and other methods of indiscriminate wepons delivery are not methods currently being used in any area where civilian casualties would likely happen. Again, read the whole thread before you make comments on what is rubbish and what's not.

Lord Sirian

I don't appreciate your constant inferences about my reading skills. I do read the information that is put in front of me. My opinion just differs from yours. I understand that your own opinion is probably biased because of being part of the country, and indeed the military in question, but please try not to let it show so blatantly.

What I really object to is the weird, almost crusader-like fervor with which America approaches conflict, especially that in the Middle-East. As I've said, the fact that America hasn't used indiscriminate methods of weapons delivery is mainly due to the fact that any use of such on their part would inevitably result in retaliation on the same scale.

djaburg

How should a nation approach conflict? I would submit that once the decision is made to engage in a conflict you approach it with an attitude that will ensure victory, would you not? Is there another way to fight a war?

Lord Sirian

Perhaps you misunderstood me. Or perhaps I didn't word it quite correctly. I simply feel that America is a little too eager to go to war with Middle-Eastern nations. I think the death toll caused by so called "Operation Enduring Freedom", not to mention the Global War on Terror, far outnumbers that caused by the attacks on September 11. Given that there were no WoMD found in Iraq, I find it very strange that American can still justify participating, and indeed, calling on others to participate in a pointless war there.

Engineer Babar

Exactly right.. the death tool is far bigger than 9/11 attacks... And that is the point I tried 1000 times to raise.. And that is one of the reasons america is facing huge resistance.. now consider a boy of age 19, who lost his family in the war and he saw the nato soldiers or bombers killing his whole family, then the revenge will rise in him.. and it is natural.. i am not supporting anybody but giving my views from a neutral point of view.. And showing the second side of the picture.. Again I will say,

LOVE IS THE NEED OF THE HOUR..

you99

Very logical indeed

Sefal

@djaburg

Afghanistan-based American drones in Pakistan between January 14, 2006 and April 8, 2009, only 10 were able to hit their actual targets, killing 14 wanted al-Qaeda leaders, besides perishing 687 innocent Pakistani civilians. The success percentage of the US predator strikes thus comes to not more than six per cent.

Three attacks conducted in 2007 had slain 66 Pakistanis, yet none of the wanted al-Qaeda or Taliban leaders could be hit by the Americans right on target. However, of the 50 drone attacks carried out between January 29, 2008 and April 8, 2009, 10 hit their targets and killed 14 wanted al-Qaeda operatives. Most of these attacks were carried out on the basis of intelligence believed to have been provided by the Pakistani and Afghan tribesmen who had been spying for the US-led allied forces stationed in Afghanistan.
The remaining 50 drone attacks went wrong due to faulty intelligence information, killing hundreds of innocent civilians, including women and children. The number of the Pakistani civilians killed in those 50 attacks stood at 537, in which 385 people lost their lives in 2008 and 152 people were slain in the first 99 days of 2009 (between January 1 and April 8).

Of the 50 drone attacks, targeting the Pakistani tribal areas since January 2008, 36 were carried out in 2008 and 14 were conducted in the first 99 days of 2009. Of the 14 attacks targeting Pakistan in 2009, three were carried out in January, killing 30 people, two in February killing 55 people, five in March killing 36 people and four were conducted in the first nine days of April, killing 31 people.

IS THIS WHAT YOU ARE AS A NATION???

SABL

This may just be a matter of deception where the US takes the blame. Where did the intelligence info come from?? I think the Afghans are setting each other up over petty squabbles and the responsibiliy and blame for casualities falls squarely in the lap of a nation that is trying to bring peace to a country that claims to have peaceful intent.

The information that lead to any attack came from local tribesmen..... you stated that in your post. What do you consider to be the DIRECT cause of failed drone missions?? Who is causing the casualities?? Who provided the intelligence report that caused the attack??

Sefal

This means that US army is so ignorant of taking innocent lives that they initiate a drone attack on the basis of information provided by mere tribesmen...without even being sure that the information provided by them is correct or false.Moreover Pakistani government has always condemned US drone attacks but US army instead of taking notice is continuing to invade into Pakistani territory without permission from the Pakistani authoraties and taking innocent lives instead of killing the terrorist or helping Pakistan.Moreover, when Pakistan army is fighting against the terrorist organizations in Pakistan so effectively then there is no need for another country to invade in our land and especially such a country that in the name of helping us is taking innocent lives of our people.

Engineer Babar

Sefal they are facing a defeat in Afghanistan... That is why they are pulling this war in Pakistan.. This is the point.. They want to prove Pakistan a stronghold of Taliban.. And want to hide their defeat in Afghanistan...

Sefal

djaburg

hehe...funny stuff.