mimo2005

Like most soldiers serving in Iraq, Joe Darby just wanted to go home when his time was up. But blowing the whistle on his unit members for abusing Iraqi prisoners changed all that, and now the former military police specialist lives in an undisclosed city with his wife, still worried for their safety.
What were his friends and neighbors saying about him after they learned he gave photos to authorities showing U.S. soldiers, some from Cumberland, abusing Iraqis at Abu Ghraib prison? "He was a rat. He was a traitor.



http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/...n2238188.shtml


He s not a traitor , but a HERO .

jeffdrummer

To the al Qaeda.

mimo2005

Hero for humanity and human rights .

You need to be a man of principles and honor in life , jeff .

jeffdrummer

Are you suggesting that I have none?

I'm not a liberal

bry623

Jeff, untill you denounce Bush and the War, you will always be moral-less.

My question is whom did he report the abuse to? If it was a superior officer, then he was following procedure and should be commended as a hero. If it was to a liberal hack in the press, then he is neither a hero, nor an anti-hero, but a narcicisitc wuss who broke chain of command.

jeffdrummer

<Liberal>Bry, I am sorry, but he obviouslt didn't use the proper procedure. Our troops are stupid, they don't even understand what a procedure is. John Kerry has made sure we all know that.</Liberal>

yustr

Perhaps reading the article before posting a sarcastic/venomous/reactionary response would make you look a little less imbecilic.

jeffdrummer

Wow, if I was afraid for my life, I really wouldn't be showing my face on CNN, I also wouldn't give my name away...

I'm getting dizzy from the spin... or is that outright lies? Hard to tell...

FYI, I read the article right when Mimo posted it... oops (let me get that egg off your face.)

mimo2005

Did you read the article jeff ?

it s your buddy rumsfeld who acted like a traitor .

Wozer

you are one sick puppy d00d...sheesus...

answer this:

if you know your employer is dumping highly toxic wastes covertly into the wilderness, what do you do?

are you a traitor for 'betraying' him, or a traitor for helping to destroy mother earth?

jeffdrummer

My employer and the military are two very different things.

Wozer

not really..this is a question of right and wrong, not right and left...

and the question is not about torture, but abuse...there is a viable argument over 'torturing' to get vital information...I have my own thoughts but let's just leave it at 'proper' torture techniques are acceptable in my eyes...

the pictures spread far and wide of the activities at Abu Ghraib went far beyond torture and are definitely far into the concept of abuse...sick people are guilty of abuse, and they need to be turned in...and yes I have seen the pictures, many of them, and they can only be called images of perversion performed by sick and twisted individuals who if are ever fathers and mothers need to have an eye kept on them for what they might do to their own children...i.e. the actions they performed were wrongness, and they deserved the punishments they received (and the superiors should have been prosecuted also)

jeffdrummer

I never said it was right and left...

I'll bite, the acts were quite gross, and bizarre, certainly not torturous. And the punishments handed out were far and swift. The guilt lies in the hands of people who say (and I am speaking of Americans), "look what barbarians we are! The Iraqis have the right to retaliate." The MSM is also guilty of playing the story up. They acted like we did the worst acts they have ever heard of, when it wasn't really that bad. It was gross, and quite bad, but not torture.

If my employer were polluting the environment, I would first go to them and ask what's going on. I wouldn't call CNN and claim gross negligence and high crimes.

But I would still say that my employer and the military are very different. I don't know how to explain any more than that... I guess what I do for my employer does have effects on national security.
Also, our dumb () troops in Iraq don't deserve the abuse that the MSM and the Democrats give them because of the actions of few. I know John Kerry was in Vietnam, that gives him a free pass to say what he will about our military right? Rule #1 in Kerry's world: When you are accused of being anti-troop, screech loudly about how you served in Vietnam.

Wozer

well it looks like you haven't kept up with media reports of what happens to people who go to their immediate superior and report such things...logically, said superior is quite aware of the violations, and any attempt to rectify the situation is seen as not being a team player..the team of course being the company, who's only desire (most of the time) is to increase profit margins...the result of actions to correct a 'violation' usually result in being shunned or worse...and even with current laws to protect whistle blowers, people (like the jerk Rumsfeld) find ways of making the person acting responsibly 'pay' for his actions...

re: national security...remember, the first lines of the Constitution are "We The People"...yeah, yeah, there is such a thing as needed secrecy, but when the government takes it as carte blanche then there is a severe problem...We The People have a necessary right to know the facts so that We The People can make decisions founded upon full and correct data...as far as I'm concerened Bush, and everyone else in government is my employee, and they had better act as such...

re: Kerry...there were without a doubt many upon many flagrant violations of proper 'decency' by our soldiers in Vietnam...certainly not all soldiers, but a definite percentage of them...so Kerry had the 'balls' to report such activities and frown upon them...like any decent person would...yet he is treated like a traitor because he had a problem with women and children being killed and raped with no just cause..what is a crime is the reaction some people are having to the truth...

jeffdrummer

Examples?

Calling our troops stupid was fine then?
Saying our troops in Veitnam were acting like Jingus (sic) Kahn was fine?
Saying our troops in Iraq go into homes in the dead of night and kill women and children was fine?

That is not giving the news, that is telling America how evil our troops are.

So I'm guessing that you don't get any speeding tickets since the police are under your command?

mimo2005

By leaking the soldier's name while he was still in iraq , how dumb can you be ?

That is a crime !

Do you understand jeff , or should i explain you more ?

jeffdrummer

I didn't know he leaked that soldier's name. Could you give me a link?

But seriously, we were having a nice debate, why did you have to call me dumb? That's inappropriate.

Wozer

ummm...heh...I guess by exact wording (which has already been 'explained' as an error in reading a pre-written speach (how lamer...)) he is guilty of calling our soldier stupid...and I'm sure some of them are...like so stupid as to use military internet connections to share a hell of a lot of sensitive photos on the Gnutella network (using LimeWire specifically as a client). How do I know this?, well I've downed quite a few of these photos, and traced the IP addresses to their military origins...and yeah, I have the knowledge to do so...there were also plenty of illegally shared mp3 files they had up for downloading...did I report them?...roflmao...that would be soooo against my ways to do so...in fact I applaud their making such photos, henceforth referred to as evidence, to the general public...NOW THAT'S WHAT FILESHARING IS FOR D00DS!...

and of course Kerry's referral to Genghis Kahn like activites is OK...in fact, it is not only desired but mandatory for a decent human to expose the immoral activites of his 'comrades'...shame becomes deceit when hidden...I have nothing but the highest respect when wrong acts are exposed and properly dealt with...there are always bad seeds, and the removal of said rotten people is necessary...hiding them away like the family embarassment only furthers the wrong and is shameful...

if our troops have gone in the middle of night and done despicible acts, then of course it is necessary to expose such acts and prosecute the wrong doers...hell, wrong doers is an understatement..I like your use of the word evil better...they are evil doers, and need to be put down like rabid dogs...not dealing with them is tantamount to condoning their activities and casts a shadow of evil upon the whole military...

yep..I get speeding tickets...that's my employee enforcing the law I just broke...your logic is lamer d00d, and your rhetoric sickening...get real and stop using such worthless methods of 'argument'....our employee Bush has lied, broken the law and furthermore shown himself to be a weakling (reading stories to kindergardners while our country is under attack?...***????)...should he be impeached?...hmmmm....that's a weighty topic...should he be exposed?, of course, and he has been and will continue to be...

jeffdrummer

So you say John Kerry is correct in saying that all of our troops act "Jingus" Kahn like. I'll use an economics term for you: fallacy of composition...

You are right when Goerge Bush (or Bu$Hitler as I call him from time to time) heard of the attacks, this is how he should have handled it, "alright kids, I'm going to let Mrs. xxxxx finnish the story for you. But I have to go now, say buh-bye to your teachers and friends, because you are probably going to die. Your parents are probably already dead." That would have shown good, mature, Democrat style, leadership. You know, tell it like it is, right, Screecher Pelosi?
It's not logical to say that critisizing all of our troops is in anyway correct, because "bad things are happening." But if all else fails blame Bu$Hitler, and his illegal and immoral crusade or oil.

Wozer

now who's guilty of twisting words around?

either learn to read correctly, pay more attention, or admit you are guilty of playing edited games...