Problems with the future

**Doonz** · 08-15-2005, 09:13 AM

More from spyware info...great site!!

Shades Of Minority Report
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I can't decide what disturbed me more about the movie Minority Report. Was it that people were being imprisoned for crimes they hadn't committed or that people couldn't move about the city without a massive network of computers taking note of their location?

I don't know whether or not someone is working out a way to read the future and catch murderers before they commit the act. I do know that people are working on ideas to track people everywhere they go. In England, they will be embedding RFID transceivers into automobile license plates. Now there is talk of doing the same thing here in the US.

It usually is at this point where someone issues the shrill battle cry "RFID only works within a few feet!". To which the obvious response is "Today it does. What about tomorrow?". Well, tomorrow has arrived. At this year's Defcon hackers convention, someone managed to transmit to and receive data from an RFID transceiver 69 feet away. Supposedly, the chips being planned for automobiles in the UK can be read at a distance of 300 feet.

When you need to be within half a meter to read these chips, they are of little concern. When they have range enough that I can sit right here at my desk and detect every chip inside of every house for two blocks in every direction, I begin to worry.

If London can afford to install half a million video cameras on its streets, Houston or New York can afford to put an RFID reader into every fourth traffic light. With a range of 300 feet, even that would be overkill. If and when that happens, your car's position can be tracked throughout every square inch of your home town.

Welcome to the future.

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Genetic Discrimination
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Since I am on the subject of movies, who remembers Gattaca? This was a movie set about 20 or 30 years in the future. Before people are born, their genes are altered to edit out any imperfections. They are stronger, smarter and faster than their natural-born counterparts and are highly unlikely ever to develop a disease.

People begin to discriminate against natural-borns, those people conceived and born without the benefit of genetic enhancement. Simply hand in a job application and the skin cells you leave on the paper will be examined to determine if you have any genetic imperfections. It is illegal, of course, but it happens anyway. Natural-borns are relegated to the low-income labor class, sweeping floors or slinging burgers.

Gattaca was an interesting, if not particularly good movie. And, like Minority Report, it predicts a problem that we may have to deal with soon out here in the real world. A few years ago, the Burlington Northern Santa Fe Railway tested the genes of workers injured on the job. This was done completely without their permission. They were looking for indications that these employees might be genetically predisposed to developing Carpal Tunnel Syndrome. The railroad was trying to find a way to avoid their obligation to pay Worker's Compensation benefits to those employees.

That may well be one of the worst ways possible in which to invade someone's privacy. I think even the "I have nothing to hide" crowd will be nervous about the idea of someone stealing parts of their body to run genetic tests. Even if they have absolutely nothing they would want to hide about their private lives, their genes are a different story. What if their boss lifts a skin cell for testing, then discovers a genetic predisposition for alcoholism left over from some distant ancestor? Will they continue heckling privacy advocates after an invasion of privacy leaves them walking home with a pink slip?

The US Senate has passed a bill which forbids employers and health insurers to discriminate against people based on information found in their genes. It is called the "Genetic Information Nondiscrimination Act of 2005". This bill now is awaiting action from the House of Representatives. The President already has indicated that he would sign it once it crosses his desk.

Unless you want your health insurance premiums to double because your family has been passing along an undesirable recessive gene since the founding of the Roman Empire, you should write to your Congressman or Congresswoman and ask him or her to vote for this bill.

yustr · 08-15-2005, 09:32 AM

The military is working on an implant that will allow tracking of each soldier on the battlefield. A good idea right for command and control.

How long do you think it will be before that technology is transferred to the rest of us? There'd be no need for vehicles to be monitored - they can monitor each of us. So even though I don't know who "they" is, you can bet it won't be done for my benefit.

**Doonz** · 08-15-2005, 10:47 AM

Actually its a pretty scary idea...milatary tracking all the soldiers on the battelfeild..

how long till some script kidde breaks into it and post the locations ALL over the internet for all to see

**koala** · 08-15-2005, 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doonz

how long till some script kidde breaks into it

Very scary! Imagine if they found a way to issue commands and started using real soldiers as players in an online wargame. We'd be getting Generals posting here for help

yustr · 08-15-2005, 12:35 PM

Scary indeed. Reminds me of...

Emporer_D · 08-15-2005, 01:13 PM

Geez, this country isn't gonna last much longer me thinks, espacilly with inflation as it is, we could be looking at a depression.

**40sondacurb** · 08-15-2005, 05:02 PM

O we'll last a while, the gap between rich and poor will just continue to widen until we're like Brazil where your ether very wealthy or very poor.

The middle class is being eliminated, but when the rich will always be rich, until china and india buy out all the companies in about 2100.

**Spatcher** · 08-15-2005, 06:00 PM

The middle class acts rich. So there is the poor, the rich-looking poor people, and the rich.

But Minority Report was great!!!

And that will be freaky...to maybe have some guy tracking down average street walkers from his computer.....

Emporer_D · 08-15-2005, 11:20 PM

Mwuhahahaha

**DumberDrummer** · 08-15-2005, 11:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Emporer_D

Geez, this country isn't gonna last much longer me thinks, espacilly with inflation as it is, we could be looking at a depression.

The country has gone through series after series of depression/recession, and a booming economy.

Why do we only hear about the great depression then you ask? It was the first world-wide depression.

We are already looking at a recession, oil prices at an all time high, ditto inflation, ditto corrupution.

I don't know what's going to happen, but I hope it isn't anything like Minority Report or the things described here. If it is, I'm moving...

Emporer_D · 08-15-2005, 11:49 PM

I meant a big one DD. We might recover. But politicans are getting more and more greed and more and more stupid. I don't think anyone could argue that coolidge(I think he was pres during the great depression, either that or kennedy, but either way my statement still applies) was any worse than the politicans we have now.

**myquitehead** · 08-16-2005, 01:19 PM

Think that was Hoover.

Emporer_D · 08-16-2005, 09:36 PM

Lol, I'm not exactly a history buff...

Chevy · 08-17-2005, 10:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doonz

Actually its a pretty scary idea...milatary tracking all the soldiers on the battelfeild..

how long till some script kidde breaks into it and post the locations ALL over the internet for all to see

Having worked military comminucations for 12 years, every bit of it dealing with encryption systems ... Ha! ... The security of military comms is incredible ... Any news reports about military computers being hacked are publicly accessible, and not encrypted like these would be.

A similar system is already in place in many combat vehicles - IVIS (Inter Vehicle Information System).

**Fox** · 08-17-2005, 10:44 AM

They day they try and get a bill passed to implant an RFID chip in me, I'm moving to canada.

**DumberDrummer** · 08-17-2005, 10:46 AM

amen. I think the terrorists are doing this.

They make it "necessary" to lose our freedoms to protect us, ie PATRIOT act, RFID, but with each freedom they take away to try and catch terrorists, the terrorists win a little more by having caused our freedoms to erode.

**MD_Willington** · 08-17-2005, 02:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fox

They day they try and get a bill passed to implant an RFID chip in me, I'm moving to canada.

There is a deadline for RFID in passports, both American and Canadian...security of the two countries is closely tied together..so even going North will not save you, I am assuming that my new Canadian passport will infact have an RFID IC or Chip in it when I renew in 2006.

Eventually they will start tagging us, the day you are born you'll get an immunization of a different sort...

08-15-2005, 09:13 AM	#1 (permalink)
Doonz S.W.A.T Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Long Island Posts: 1,481 OS: WinXP, Vista, MAC 10.x	Problems with the future More from spyware info...great site!! Shades Of Minority Report Permalink \| Top I can't decide what disturbed me more about the movie Minority Report. Was it that people were being imprisoned for crimes they hadn't committed or that people couldn't move about the city without a massive network of computers taking note of their location? I don't know whether or not someone is working out a way to read the future and catch murderers before they commit the act. I do know that people are working on ideas to track people everywhere they go. In England, they will be embedding RFID transceivers into automobile license plates. Now there is talk of doing the same thing here in the US. It usually is at this point where someone issues the shrill battle cry "RFID only works within a few feet!". To which the obvious response is "Today it does. What about tomorrow?". Well, tomorrow has arrived. At this year's Defcon hackers convention, someone managed to transmit to and receive data from an RFID transceiver 69 feet away. Supposedly, the chips being planned for automobiles in the UK can be read at a distance of 300 feet. When you need to be within half a meter to read these chips, they are of little concern. When they have range enough that I can sit right here at my desk and detect every chip inside of every house for two blocks in every direction, I begin to worry. If London can afford to install half a million video cameras on its streets, Houston or New York can afford to put an RFID reader into every fourth traffic light. With a range of 300 feet, even that would be overkill. If and when that happens, your car's position can be tracked throughout every square inch of your home town. Welcome to the future. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Genetic Discrimination Permalink \| Top Since I am on the subject of movies, who remembers Gattaca? This was a movie set about 20 or 30 years in the future. Before people are born, their genes are altered to edit out any imperfections. They are stronger, smarter and faster than their natural-born counterparts and are highly unlikely ever to develop a disease. People begin to discriminate against natural-borns, those people conceived and born without the benefit of genetic enhancement. Simply hand in a job application and the skin cells you leave on the paper will be examined to determine if you have any genetic imperfections. It is illegal, of course, but it happens anyway. Natural-borns are relegated to the low-income labor class, sweeping floors or slinging burgers. Gattaca was an interesting, if not particularly good movie. And, like Minority Report, it predicts a problem that we may have to deal with soon out here in the real world. A few years ago, the Burlington Northern Santa Fe Railway tested the genes of workers injured on the job. This was done completely without their permission. They were looking for indications that these employees might be genetically predisposed to developing Carpal Tunnel Syndrome. The railroad was trying to find a way to avoid their obligation to pay Worker's Compensation benefits to those employees. That may well be one of the worst ways possible in which to invade someone's privacy. I think even the "I have nothing to hide" crowd will be nervous about the idea of someone stealing parts of their body to run genetic tests. Even if they have absolutely nothing they would want to hide about their private lives, their genes are a different story. What if their boss lifts a skin cell for testing, then discovers a genetic predisposition for alcoholism left over from some distant ancestor? Will they continue heckling privacy advocates after an invasion of privacy leaves them walking home with a pink slip? The US Senate has passed a bill which forbids employers and health insurers to discriminate against people based on information found in their genes. It is called the "Genetic Information Nondiscrimination Act of 2005". This bill now is awaiting action from the House of Representatives. The President already has indicated that he would sign it once it crosses his desk. Unless you want your health insurance premiums to double because your family has been passing along an undesirable recessive gene since the founding of the Roman Empire, you should write to your Congressman or Congresswoman and ask him or her to vote for this bill. __________________ Simple Wise-A%$ Techie

08-15-2005, 09:32 AM	#2 (permalink)
yustr Asst. Manager, The Conversation Pit Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Connecticut shore Posts: 4,994 OS: XP Pro My System	The military is working on an implant that will allow tracking of each soldier on the battlefield. A good idea right for command and control. How long do you think it will be before that technology is transferred to the rest of us? There'd be no need for vehicles to be monitored - they can monitor each of us. So even though I don't know who "they" is, you can bet it won't be done for my benefit. __________________ I didn't mean to say it. But I meant what I said. J. McMurtry In Vino Veritas

08-15-2005, 10:47 AM	#3 (permalink)
Doonz S.W.A.T Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Long Island Posts: 1,481 OS: WinXP, Vista, MAC 10.x	Actually its a pretty scary idea...milatary tracking all the soldiers on the battelfeild.. how long till some script kidde breaks into it and post the locations ALL over the internet for all to see __________________ Simple Wise-A%$ Techie

08-15-2005, 01:13 PM	#6 (permalink)
Emporer_D Registered User Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Pacific Northwest Posts: 237 OS: XP Home SP2, Ubuntu 8.04 My System	Geez, this country isn't gonna last much longer me thinks, espacilly with inflation as it is, we could be looking at a depression. __________________ Your mind is like a sword, it's easier to kill people when it's sharp.

08-15-2005, 05:02 PM	#7 (permalink)
40sondacurb #64 & #36 BACKBONE Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 5,804 OS: xp	O we'll last a while, the gap between rich and poor will just continue to widen until we're like Brazil where your ether very wealthy or very poor. The middle class is being eliminated, but when the rich will always be rich, until china and india buy out all the companies in about 2100. __________________ Donate to keep the forum running "I know the human being and fish can coexist peacefully" -George W. Bush

08-15-2005, 06:00 PM	#8 (permalink)
Spatcher Henry Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 3,467 OS: XP Home SP2 My System	The middle class acts rich. So there is the poor, the rich-looking poor people, and the rich. But Minority Report was great!!! And that will be freaky...to maybe have some guy tracking down average street walkers from his computer..... __________________ JohnThePilot: Cenedl heb iaith, cenedl heb galon (a nation without a language is a nation without a heart) John Butler Trio: Go take a step outside, see what's shakin' in the real world - Good Excuse Paul Kelly: Just add a dollop of tomato sauce for sweetness and that extra tang - How to Make Gravy

08-15-2005, 11:20 PM	#9 (permalink)
Emporer_D Registered User Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Pacific Northwest Posts: 237 OS: XP Home SP2, Ubuntu 8.04 My System	Mwuhahahaha __________________ Your mind is like a sword, it's easier to kill people when it's sharp.

08-15-2005, 11:49 PM	#11 (permalink)
Emporer_D Registered User Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Pacific Northwest Posts: 237 OS: XP Home SP2, Ubuntu 8.04 My System	I meant a big one DD. We might recover. But politicans are getting more and more greed and more and more stupid. I don't think anyone could argue that coolidge(I think he was pres during the great depression, either that or kennedy, but either way my statement still applies) was any worse than the politicans we have now. __________________ Your mind is like a sword, it's easier to kill people when it's sharp.

08-16-2005, 01:19 PM	#12 (permalink)
myquitehead TSF Enthusiast Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 570 OS: XP Pro Sp1	Think that was Hoover.

08-16-2005, 09:36 PM	#13 (permalink)
Emporer_D Registered User Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Pacific Northwest Posts: 237 OS: XP Home SP2, Ubuntu 8.04 My System	Lol, I'm not exactly a history buff... __________________ Your mind is like a sword, it's easier to kill people when it's sharp.

08-17-2005, 10:44 AM	#15 (permalink)
Fox TSF Enthusiast Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: NJ Posts: 7,752 OS: XP Pro, CentOS My System	They day they try and get a bill passed to implant an RFID chip in me, I'm moving to canada. __________________ Antec Neo Power 500W, ABIT IP35-E, Intel E2180@2.66Ghz, Corsair XMS2 2x1GB DDR2-800, PNY 8800GT, 320GB Seagate * lazy college student alert *- If I've inadvertently ignored a thread, please Let me know about it Have I helped you solve your problem? Donate to Techsupportforums Klart Skepp!

08-17-2005, 10:46 AM	#16 (permalink)
DumberDrummer Cymru am byth Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Oregon Posts: 5,377 OS: Windows XP Pro SP2 My System	amen. I think the terrorists are doing this. They make it "necessary" to lose our freedoms to protect us, ie PATRIOT act, RFID, but with each freedom they take away to try and catch terrorists, the terrorists win a little more by having caused our freedoms to erode. __________________ Living with Louie dog's the only way to stay sane _____________________________________________ ... and with those words so begins my lifetime of longing for the devil's warm embrace