When uploading just a little, my internet slows to a crawl

Phoenix Edge · 09-04-2005, 07:09 PM

I use a fiber optic SBC DSL.. I can download about 650 KB/s and upload about 120 KB/s, according to the connection speed that I pay for. My modem is the modem that my ISP provided me with; it's a NetFLX modem, a special modem used for the fiber optic lines. My router is a D-Link 11a/11g Dualband Wireless 108 Mbps router. I don't like wireless, so I just plug my network card on my computer into the LAN port on the router. My room mate, however, wants wireless, so the router provides him with that. However, there is a problem. When only uploading about 10-15 KB/s, my internet slows significantly! As a test, this is what I did. I made sure I was not downloading or uploading anything. My room mate's computer was off. I pinged google, and got an average ping of about 70 ms. I then sent a file to a friend via AIM. I was uploading to him at 16 kb/s. I then pinged google again. This time, I got an average latency of about 500 ms.

Now, that seems to be the simplest way of explaining my problem. However, things get more complicated as I add more variables into the mix. I tried uploading a file via gmail while simultaneously uploading that file to my friend on AIM. I still got a ping of about 500 ms to google. So, I open up Netlimiter (a nifty program that let's you see how much each process on your computer is uploading/downloading, and let's you set up and down caps on each process, or on your computer as a whole) to further diagnose what's going on. The upload rates of gmail and AIM add up to 16 kb/s! If gmail was taking 8 kb/s of my upstream, then AIM would be taking up 8 kb/s. If gmail was taking up 2, then AIM would be taking up 14. If gmail was taking up 10, then AIM would be taking up 4. See, they would always add up to 16! So it seems that for some odd reason my internet is being capped to 16 kb/s upstream. How is this possible? Please note that Netlimiter has nothing to do with this, as I made 100% sure I wasn't limitting ANYTHING. I then used netlimiter to cap the upload of AIM and gmail to 5 kb/s each, so I wasn't uploading anything over 10 kb/s. And I still was getting pings in the 400 to 500 range to google.

Ok now here's where things get REALLY wierd. You know how I can limit the up and downstreams of any process on my computer using Netlimiter, right? Well... If I limit AIM so that it can only upload at 5 kb/s, and it's currently uploading at 15 kb/s, AIM's upload rate will steadily decrease over the course of about a minute until it reaches 5 kb/s. So, I throw gmail out of the equation, and just keep uploading to my friend at 16 kb/s on AIM. I then use Netlimiter to limit AIM to 5 kb/s up. IMMEDIATELY, my ping to google is about 70 kb/s even when AIM is still uploading at 16 kb/s (remember, it takes about a minute for the upload rate to go down)

So my question is, how can I upload at 100 kb/s, like I should be able to with my connection, without my internet slowing to a crawl?

Phoenix Edge · 09-04-2005, 07:47 PM

Ok, here is an interesting new development. I've found that when uploading and my internet slows to a crawl, browsing my router configuation ALSO slows to a crawl! It will take ages for the webpages off my router to load, but as soon as I stop all uploading, webpages off my router load lightning quick.

**johnwill** · 09-05-2005, 11:16 AM

FWIW, the 160kb specification for your uploads is bits, not bytes. Since you're seeing the upload times in bytes, you need to divide that by 8, and think of a maximum of 20kbytes/sec upload speeds.

From what I see, it's probably normal operation. Whenever you totally clog up the upload channel, you'll see reduced performance on the download side.

I have a 6000/384 Comcast account, and if I sent a large file, the speed of browsing is much slower than when the upload side is idle, nature of the beast.

Phoenix Edge · 09-05-2005, 05:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnwill

FWIW, the 160kb specification for your uploads is bits, not bytes. Since you're seeing the upload times in bytes, you need to divide that by 8, and think of a maximum of 20kbytes/sec upload speeds.

From what I see, it's probably normal operation. Whenever you totally clog up the upload channel, you'll see reduced performance on the download side.

I have a 6000/384 Comcast account, and if I sent a large file, the speed of browsing is much slower than when the upload side is idle, nature of the beast.

Well actually, the specific connection I have is about 5 megabits down, 1 megabit up, so I should be able to upload at about 120 kb/s, like I said.

**johnwill** · 09-07-2005, 05:35 PM

OK, it's nice if you are specific about what you have in the first place, it makes it easier to try to diagnose what's going on.

Have you tried connecting directly to the modem and seeing if uploading impacts your browsing speeds?

**JamesO** · 09-08-2005, 12:17 AM

Are you sure you have fiber DSL?? Fiber to your house??

500 ms latency is BAD to anything. 500 ms may be due to link saturation. Your ping times from your house to your ISP should be in the 5-15 ms range.

What is the latency when you have no load on your connection? Do a traceroute and see what the first hop is from your house, trying an extended ping on that addresss as well as Google and see if the latency increases as you load things up.

Sounds like you or your service provider are saturating the link at some point and/or there is a network problem. Also note a IP connection is typically saturated at 80-85% and your once your upload reaches saturation, your downloads will crawl due to upload packet acknowlegements being buffered.

JamesO

09-04-2005, 07:09 PM	#1 (permalink)
Phoenix Edge Registered User Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 7 OS: Windows XP	When uploading just a little, my internet slows to a crawl I use a fiber optic SBC DSL.. I can download about 650 KB/s and upload about 120 KB/s, according to the connection speed that I pay for. My modem is the modem that my ISP provided me with; it's a NetFLX modem, a special modem used for the fiber optic lines. My router is a D-Link 11a/11g Dualband Wireless 108 Mbps router. I don't like wireless, so I just plug my network card on my computer into the LAN port on the router. My room mate, however, wants wireless, so the router provides him with that. However, there is a problem. When only uploading about 10-15 KB/s, my internet slows significantly! As a test, this is what I did. I made sure I was not downloading or uploading anything. My room mate's computer was off. I pinged google, and got an average ping of about 70 ms. I then sent a file to a friend via AIM. I was uploading to him at 16 kb/s. I then pinged google again. This time, I got an average latency of about 500 ms. Now, that seems to be the simplest way of explaining my problem. However, things get more complicated as I add more variables into the mix. I tried uploading a file via gmail while simultaneously uploading that file to my friend on AIM. I still got a ping of about 500 ms to google. So, I open up Netlimiter (a nifty program that let's you see how much each process on your computer is uploading/downloading, and let's you set up and down caps on each process, or on your computer as a whole) to further diagnose what's going on. The upload rates of gmail and AIM add up to 16 kb/s! If gmail was taking 8 kb/s of my upstream, then AIM would be taking up 8 kb/s. If gmail was taking up 2, then AIM would be taking up 14. If gmail was taking up 10, then AIM would be taking up 4. See, they would always add up to 16! So it seems that for some odd reason my internet is being capped to 16 kb/s upstream. How is this possible? Please note that Netlimiter has nothing to do with this, as I made 100% sure I wasn't limitting ANYTHING. I then used netlimiter to cap the upload of AIM and gmail to 5 kb/s each, so I wasn't uploading anything over 10 kb/s. And I still was getting pings in the 400 to 500 range to google. Ok now here's where things get REALLY wierd. You know how I can limit the up and downstreams of any process on my computer using Netlimiter, right? Well... If I limit AIM so that it can only upload at 5 kb/s, and it's currently uploading at 15 kb/s, AIM's upload rate will steadily decrease over the course of about a minute until it reaches 5 kb/s. So, I throw gmail out of the equation, and just keep uploading to my friend at 16 kb/s on AIM. I then use Netlimiter to limit AIM to 5 kb/s up. IMMEDIATELY, my ping to google is about 70 kb/s even when AIM is still uploading at 16 kb/s (remember, it takes about a minute for the upload rate to go down) So my question is, how can I upload at 100 kb/s, like I should be able to with my connection, without my internet slowing to a crawl? Last edited by Phoenix Edge; 09-04-2005 at 07:14 PM. Reason: Additional comment

09-05-2005, 11:16 AM	#3 (permalink)
johnwill Manager, Networking Forums Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: S.E. Pennsylvania, US Posts: 41,857 OS: Windows 7, XP-Pro, Vista, Linux Blog Entries: 1	FWIW, the 160kb specification for your uploads is bits, not bytes. Since you're seeing the upload times in bytes, you need to divide that by 8, and think of a maximum of 20kbytes/sec upload speeds. From what I see, it's probably normal operation. Whenever you totally clog up the upload channel, you'll see reduced performance on the download side. I have a 6000/384 Comcast account, and if I sent a large file, the speed of browsing is much slower than when the upload side is idle, nature of the beast. __________________ If TSF has helped you, Tell us about it! or Donate to help keep the site up! Microsoft MVP - Windows Desktop Experience

09-07-2005, 05:35 PM	#5 (permalink)
johnwill Manager, Networking Forums Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: S.E. Pennsylvania, US Posts: 41,857 OS: Windows 7, XP-Pro, Vista, Linux Blog Entries: 1	OK, it's nice if you are specific about what you have in the first place, it makes it easier to try to diagnose what's going on. Have you tried connecting directly to the modem and seeing if uploading impacts your browsing speeds? __________________ If TSF has helped you, Tell us about it! or Donate to help keep the site up! Microsoft MVP - Windows Desktop Experience

09-04-2005, 07:47 PM	#2 (permalink)
Phoenix Edge Registered User Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 7 OS: Windows XP	Ok, here is an interesting new development. I've found that when uploading and my internet slows to a crawl, browsing my router configuation ALSO slows to a crawl! It will take ages for the webpages off my router to load, but as soon as I stop all uploading, webpages off my router load lightning quick.

09-08-2005, 12:17 AM	#6 (permalink)
JamesO Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Fairfax, VA USA Posts: 2,289 OS: 98SE, W2k Pro, XP Pro	Are you sure you have fiber DSL?? Fiber to your house?? 500 ms latency is BAD to anything. 500 ms may be due to link saturation. Your ping times from your house to your ISP should be in the 5-15 ms range. What is the latency when you have no load on your connection? Do a traceroute and see what the first hop is from your house, trying an extended ping on that addresss as well as Google and see if the latency increases as you load things up. Sounds like you or your service provider are saturating the link at some point and/or there is a network problem. Also note a IP connection is typically saturated at 80-85% and your once your upload reaches saturation, your downloads will crawl due to upload packet acknowlegements being buffered. JamesO