SYSTEM.INI is freezing machine on bootup

jaytechman · 11-17-2005, 11:23 PM

My SYSTEM.INI file is freezing the machine on bootup.

P-III/500 with 384 MB RAM, W98 SE, working fine for years; carefully maintained.

Recently on removing the digital LCD monitor and leaving the computer off for a week with power cord unplugged during a hurricane, on returning and trying it it wouldn't boot, and a local tech shop isolated it to the Norton Anti-Virus, so I unintalled it and it worked fine, even after reinstalling it. I have no idea if there's any connection here, but a month or two later, I did the same thing -- removed the monitor and took it with me during a hurricane and left the computer off (but plugged in this time). On returning and hooking it back up, it won't boot, but I've isolated the problem to the SYSTEM.INI file for sure. (If I uncheck it in MSCONFIG, it will boot fine, but with it on I can only boot into Safe Mode by using F8 or holding Ctrl during the intial boot sequence.)

I've tried the following to no avail:

- restore the SYSTEM.TSH version (I have no idea what that is but the comments that they system added to the top of SYSTEM.INI say that was automatically created as a backup, and the date is just a few days ago)

- remove the network cable (hey, gotta try whatever seems possible, right?)

- move the SYSTEM.INI file to somewhere else on the hard drive (I cut and pasted the file to a floppy, then copied that file to another place on the floppy thus getting a "Copy of" file, then renamed the "Copy of" to "X," then copied "X" to the Windows folder, and then renamed "X" to "SYSTEM.INI").

I'm still in low-res mode, too, ever since reconnecting the monitor. It's a Sony 15" which I've been using for years on this machine. I go into Display properties and it does have the right driver, but I can't manage to change the setting from 16-color and 640x480 to High Color and 1024x768 -- it just comes back to the old settings on reboot.

Well, I've put the SYSTEM.INI and SYSTEM.TSH files on a web site, along with a backup of the SYSTEM.INI FILE from three years ago (SYSTEM.BAK):

SYSTEM.INI

SYSTEM.TSH

SYSTEM.BAK

Thanks!

J

Geekgirl · 11-18-2005, 06:12 AM

Did you try Running the System File Checker

Go to the Run box on the Start Menu and type in:

sfc /scannow ( sfc if not reconized)

This command will immediately initiate the Windows File Protection service to scan all protected files and verify their integrity, replacing any files with which it finds a problem. You will need your Windows cd.

Also check in the Device Manager for any yellow ?, your video doent sound as if the drivers are installed properly. Try removing and reinstalling

jaytechman · 11-18-2005, 06:28 PM

Geekgirl,

Thanks for the advice.

Other inquiries have led to a strong suspicion it's a corrupted Display Adapter situation. We even confirmed that by going into MSCONFIG and enabling SYSTEM.INI (making it all normal startup procedures enabled) but going into Advanced and choosing VGA mode, and that enabled a successful boot into normal Windows mode.

So, the question now, besides wondering what could have caused the problem, is whether it's more advisable to uninstall and reinstall the display adapter drivers, which have been running fine up until now (no, there are no yellow flags in Device Manger -- it says it's all functioning properly), or to restore a registry backup from a month or so ago (probably no real system configuration changes have occurred since then) using the Run - ScanReg / Restore.

It's a business system that I'd rather go the extra mile in being careful about keeping as well maintained as possible. It's an older W98 machine and we're on XP on the main computers in the office, of course, but we still use this one.

So, which do you think is more elegant of an approach? Drivers or restore reg?

Thanks!

Stu_computer · 11-18-2005, 09:24 PM

Well, there are two different display drivers listed other than that the tsh and bak files are the same.

System-bak: display.drv=RADEON VE

System-tsh: display.drv=RADEON 7000 SERIES

Turn system.ini back on in MSCONFIG then reboot to DOS command prompt only.

Execute these 5 commands and reboot.
cd windows
attrib -h -r system.*
ren system.ini system.dud
copy system.bak system.ini
attrib +h +r system.*

If display isn't normal then reinstall video driver.

jaytechman · 11-18-2005, 11:28 PM

I'm not sure which is supposed to be there, VE or 7000.

I did try replacing the current SYSTEM.INI file with the TSH file, but I realize from what you're saying that doesn't change anything.

Can I just go into Windows Explorer via Safe Mode and rename the files? Or, just edit SYSTEM.INI to make the display driver what BAK has?

I'm a bit confused, though. I can't figure what should have made the INI file change... and it's been working fine all along, until I disconnected the monitor for a few weeks.

I can probably get a backup of the INI file from a few months ago when I last did a tape backup. Maybe that would be better. While I look into that, I'll look forward to your responses to my above questions.

Thanks so much!!!

jaytechman · 11-19-2005, 01:29 AM

Well, thanks to your comments I recovered a backup of the SYSTEM.INI file from Jan '05 and it's identical to the current version. So, it's not the SYSTEM.INI file (since the machine has worked fine until just recently).

Stu_computer · 11-19-2005, 02:27 AM

Quote:

Can I just go into Windows Explorer via Safe Mode and rename the files? Or, just edit SYSTEM.INI to make the display driver what BAK has?

After MSCONFIG has reactivated it you can access it any way you're familiar with, just make sure the content of the system.ini is the full version like the tsh content you posted here.

Quote:

I'm not sure which is supposed to be there, VE or 7000.

I'm a bit confused, though. I can't figure what should have made the INI file change... and it's been working fine all along, until I disconnected the monitor for a few weeks.

When you "deactivated" system.ini with MSCONFIG the file extension was actually just renamed to tsh and then an abridged ini file was made to replace it because windows98 has to have a system.ini file for normal boot up. (When win98 boots in safe mode it uses a file named system.cb instead of system.ini)

When you "reactivate" system.ini with MSCONFIG that system.tsh file is made the system.ini file again. So your back where you started.

There has been changes, the file date of the bak file will tell you when the last change was made. The current system.ini (tsh) file now has a different video driver and a divx.dll added, (and a different NIC number-not relevant to the video problem though), which suggests someone has installed a divx player or at least the codec to watch divx format videos (avi's). If that was all done at the same time or different times I don't know. That is all I can tell you with this data, a full forensic report requires access to the hard drive.

Maybe it'll just be easier to uninstall the video driver and reboot and let windows reinstall it so you can change to the settings you want.

jaytechman · 11-19-2005, 03:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stu_computer

Maybe it'll just be easier to uninstall the video driver and reboot and let windows reinstall it so you can change to the settings you want.

That's exactly what I thought, too. So I did that, and it still didn't help.

So, I downloaded the current driver from ATI and tried to install that (by just running its setup program), and it STILL isn't working! I've tried everything:

- removed -h and -r from system.* files before installation of drivers

- did the driver install in Safe mode

- did the driver install in Normal mode

- left VGA Mode enabled on saying Yes to Restart after the driver install

- left VGA Mode disabled on saying Yes to Restart after the driver install

I still have the exact same symptoms: I can get into Windows only in Safe Mode or with MSCONFIG Advanced set to VGA Mode.

The one thing I may be getting wrong is the uninstall of the old driver. I started out doing that before I did anything else, but then the mandatory rebooting resulted in Windows automatically reinstalling it. So, I just ignored that and once it rebooted I ran the setup program for the new driver. It eventually says the ATI control panel isn't loading "because it either isn't installed right or the ATI driver isn't working properly."

Now what? Do I restore a registry backup?

Thanks!

Stu_computer · 11-19-2005, 08:18 PM

This the file you downloaded? 5-9_wme_dd_cp_26397.exe

Go to add/remove programs and remove the ati software then change the video driver to generic vga (select from list). Reboot, should go to normal desktop okay, if not then there is some other problem. Now try the ati setup and reboot, then change settings.

jaytechman · 11-20-2005, 02:37 AM

Yes, that's the setup file I downloaded.

Did Add/Remove of all ATI okay and rebooted. Went to Standard VGA and rebooted okay (without needing VGA Mode set in MSCONFIG Advanced).

Then ran ATI Setup with new download and rebooted... but it lost the video (etc?) again halfway through the bootup process, same as it's been doing.

What do you think?

Thanks again!

Stu_computer · 11-20-2005, 09:21 PM

Well, that package extracts to C:\ATI\SUPPORT\5-9_wme_dd_cp_26397, if you didn't change the path.

So you could do "update driver-have disk" and then navigate to that path. It will then locate an inf file or prompt you none found-you may have to go further into the path till you get the 9X_INF folder.

It will show some error message if it's the wrong driver.

jaytechman · 11-20-2005, 10:15 PM

I actually did try exactly what you suggested, and for some odd reason when I pointed to the 9x_INF folder, even though Windows recognized that it had an INF file in it (it gave me the OK button, which it won't do otherwise), when I did hit OK it said it can't find a correct driver. If I looked in the folder, there are a few INF files, and when I go into the INF using other Have Disk choices there are plenty of Radeon choices, but even after I picked one, it still installed but then said it's not the right driver. And the problem remained after I went ahead and installed it anyway.

I've now carefully wiped every trace of ATI and checked that it succeeded. At one point, an installation attempt of the ATI Setup said I should set the video to VGA before doing so. I used the List - Have Disk approach rather than MSCONFIG. Then, after all was very clean, I ran the install again.

I was really thorough this time, too. I even deleted all TEMP files/folders beforehand just to be extra safe (I've seen installation routines hang up there on occasion).

Same problem still exists.

Note that when I go into Add/Remove and try to remove the ATI driver, it has it listed but it says "Error initializing" when I select it and try to proceed. It removes the ATI Control Panel OK and runs the ATI Software Uninstall from Add/Remove Ok as well. But trying ATI driver, which I try "first," doesn't.

I'm thinking now that maybe I should wonder about the video card... (I can't find a diagnostic on the ATI CD or web site)...

Or try restoring a registry backup...

Or, what...?

Thanks again!

Jay

Stu_computer · 11-20-2005, 10:43 PM

Try this file instead...
Hydravision Basic Edition 3.25.9006
http://www.ati.com/products/Hydravision/index.html

I have extracted and attached the text file from it so you can read it beforehand.

F) ISSUES YOU MAY ENCOUNTER:
VERSION CONFLICTS

jaytechman · 11-21-2005, 03:40 AM

Somehow I'm pretty sure that's not it.

At one point last night after I had wiped all traces of ATI software and drivers from the system and was running Standard VGA, Windows Update told me there's an update for the driver and I let it download the 2002 ATI driver. Same problem!

I've now even gone so far as to have removed and replaced the video card. Actually, what I did was this in sequence:

- set the display adapter to Standard VGA (seems to take two reboots until that's what shows in Display-Settings-Advanced-Adapter)

- Add/Remove to remove all ATI (and reboot)

- delete all Windows\Temp files/folders

- delete the recent ATI installation folder

- remove and reinstall the video card

- run the recent ATI setup

SAME PROBLEM STILL!!!

So, time to replace the video card, do you think?

Or what?

**oshwyn5** · 11-21-2005, 12:20 PM

That this happens when you leave the computer off and unplugged for a week makes me suspect it is a bios setting issue. When the computer is off and unplugged , it relies on the cmos retention battery to supply power to retain the custom bios settings needed for your system.
When you power up the first time, it finds that they have been lost and will try loading "optimal defaults" . Some times this is not good enough.
Have you ever had a problem with your hard drive not being detected (load system disk , press enter to proceed) but on restart it is? When did you last replace the battery and did you reconfigure your bios afterwards?

Secondly, you mention that disabling system.ini in msconfig lets you boot to windows. Good, so the next thing is to open msconfig return the check to load system.ini and then go to the system.ini tab and uncheck everything. You then reboot and add items back one at a time starting at the top.
When it barfs you know which section it is in. Your mention of Norton Antivirus causing it, makes me suspect that there may be something bad loading.

Your system.tsh containing ctpnpscn.drv

Quote:

[boot]
oemfonts.fon=vgaoem.fon
shell=Explorer.exe
system.drv=atmsys.drv
drivers=mmsystem.dll power.drv ctpnpscn.drv

makes me wonder if this could be your problem. Somthing related to a soundblaster.
http://www.ericlindsay.com/computer/winshit.htm

Quote:

Sbide.sys

Some versions of Win95 modify Config.Sys by changing the /p option in the SBIDE.SYS line to the wrong address. Either write protect Config.sys, or get rid of the file that makes the changes namely \windows\system\ctpnpscn.drv Rename it, then edit \windows\system.ini to get rid of all references to it. This seems to be a file provided by Sound Blaster.

The listing of Radeon 7000 in one file and Radeon VE in the other is odd unless you forced an incorrect driver to install.

Here is something worth a try.

Save what you have in the system.ini file and the using the start/ run command of sysedit paste in the contents of the sample system.ini file you have and save it. (note just copy from where it says [boot] down, not that warning stuff)
Then go to device manager and delete everything listed there.
Then restart the computer and let it get redetect your hardware and add load their drivers and add the correct entries.

Stu_computer · 11-22-2005, 08:50 PM

The problem is specific to the video card not accepting the 32-bit drivers, it works okay in vga mode.

I doubt the CMOS battery was the culprit as loss of BIOS and ESCD settings manifest in POST errors, well before windows starts loading. There's no mention of other device problems or having to reset the BIOS settings.

At this point it has failed to accept several compatible windows drivers which pretty much indicates the card itself is faulty, perhaps not seated properly, or the card slot is the problem.

jaytechman · 11-23-2005, 12:54 AM

I've now replaced the video card with a newer one that's compatible with the system and even spoke with ATI tech support to make sure I'm not missing anything. Uninstalled all traces of ATI and then installed their current drivers.

Still didn't work. Same problem.

I then used the selective approach to isolate the line in System.ini that was preventing the bootup into Windows Normal Mode to complete, and what I found is that if I rem out the following line in the BOOT section it will boot into Normal Mode:

display.drv=pnpdrvr.drv

However, I've also noticed a few other things as well:

- That line definitely existed in the System.ini file that worked fine a year ago so that line isn't really the problem, per se. In fact, my simply going into Device Manger and removing the Radeon driver from Display, and rebooting, caused Windows to put that line back after I had remmed it out!

- There has recently been added a line at the bottom of the BOOT section that I've never seen before (but remming it out doesn't solve the problem):

original_display.drv=pnpdrvr.drv

- Even when it boots successfully into Windows Normal Mode, when I go into the Display - Settings and try to increase the resolution from 640 x 480, the following happens:

- Moving the slider to 1024 x 768 only allows the Colors dropdown to be at 16 or 256; if I first set the dropdown to High Color and then drag the slider from 640 x 480 to 1024 x 768, that causes the Colors to revert to 256. And even with that happening and my leaving it at 1024 x 768 with 256 colors, my attempting to Apply that always fails -- the restart brings it right back to where it was: 640 x 480 and 16 colors. (It's a 15" Sony LCD using DVI and it shows up properly under Monitors, so that's probably not it.)

By the way:

- Nothing jumps out at me as being out of whack in the BIOS (and I agree that I'd be seeing other problems if the battery/BIOS were the problem).

- Norton was a problem after the system was off for a while a few months ago but in a very different way: The system wouldn't boot until we disabled or deleted NAV -- an outside tech did it and I don't recall which he did. When I got the system back, I reinstalled NAV and it's worked fine for months ever since. (Not that I have any idea what caused that problem at the time.)

So...

Maybe it is a bad video card slot?

Any other thoughts?

Thanks!!!

Stu_computer · 11-23-2005, 07:42 AM

pnpdrvr.drv is the win9x default video driver.

Few things you might look at:
1. make sure [BOOT] is the very first line in system.ini as starting with a blank line can cause problems.
2. check win.ini content as it has display data as well and loads after system.ini so it's remotely possible the error is in win.ini based on system.ini content passed to it.

Other than that Gg already had you do the System File Checker routine, you can do a scandisk and reinstalling 98 on top of itself (same directory) to replace all the 98 files on the off chance the vxd is corrupt and a new one fixes the problem. Then reinstall the mobo chipset drivers before doing the video driver.

11-17-2005, 11:23 PM	#1 (permalink)
jaytechman Registered User Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 62 OS: XP Pro	SYSTEM.INI is freezing machine on bootup My SYSTEM.INI file is freezing the machine on bootup. P-III/500 with 384 MB RAM, W98 SE, working fine for years; carefully maintained. Recently on removing the digital LCD monitor and leaving the computer off for a week with power cord unplugged during a hurricane, on returning and trying it it wouldn't boot, and a local tech shop isolated it to the Norton Anti-Virus, so I unintalled it and it worked fine, even after reinstalling it. I have no idea if there's any connection here, but a month or two later, I did the same thing -- removed the monitor and took it with me during a hurricane and left the computer off (but plugged in this time). On returning and hooking it back up, it won't boot, but I've isolated the problem to the SYSTEM.INI file for sure. (If I uncheck it in MSCONFIG, it will boot fine, but with it on I can only boot into Safe Mode by using F8 or holding Ctrl during the intial boot sequence.) I've tried the following to no avail: - restore the SYSTEM.TSH version (I have no idea what that is but the comments that they system added to the top of SYSTEM.INI say that was automatically created as a backup, and the date is just a few days ago) - remove the network cable (hey, gotta try whatever seems possible, right?) - move the SYSTEM.INI file to somewhere else on the hard drive (I cut and pasted the file to a floppy, then copied that file to another place on the floppy thus getting a "Copy of" file, then renamed the "Copy of" to "X," then copied "X" to the Windows folder, and then renamed "X" to "SYSTEM.INI"). I'm still in low-res mode, too, ever since reconnecting the monitor. It's a Sony 15" which I've been using for years on this machine. I go into Display properties and it does have the right driver, but I can't manage to change the setting from 16-color and 640x480 to High Color and 1024x768 -- it just comes back to the old settings on reboot. Well, I've put the SYSTEM.INI and SYSTEM.TSH files on a web site, along with a backup of the SYSTEM.INI FILE from three years ago (SYSTEM.BAK): SYSTEM.INI SYSTEM.TSH SYSTEM.BAK Thanks! J Last edited by jaytechman; 11-17-2005 at 11:37 PM.

11-18-2005, 06:12 AM	#2 (permalink)
Geekgirl Assistant Manager, Microsoft Support Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Six-burgh, Pennsylvania Posts: 14,164 OS: XP Home SP3/XP Pro SP3/Vista Ultimate SP2/Windows 7 Professional	Did you try Running the System File Checker Go to the Run box on the Start Menu and type in: sfc /scannow ( sfc if not reconized) This command will immediately initiate the Windows File Protection service to scan all protected files and verify their integrity, replacing any files with which it finds a problem. You will need your Windows cd. Also check in the Device Manager for any yellow ?, your video doent sound as if the drivers are installed properly. Try removing and reinstalling __________________ Compare NOD32 to your current antivirus and anti-spyware solution, HERE How to back up and restore the registry in Windows XP and Windows Vista Or Windows 7 How to back up and restore the registry in Windows 98/ ME / NT 4.0 / 2000 I DO NOT ACCEPT EMAILS AND WILL NOT REPLY TO THEM !!!!! TSF DOES NOT SUPPORT ASSISTANCE THROUGH EMAIL OR PRIVATE MESSAGES, PLEASE KEEP ALL QUESTIONS IN THE OPEN FORUM *The Pittsburgh Steelers - 6 X Superbowl Champions !!!!!!!* *The Pittsburgh Penguins - 2009 Stanley Cup Champions !!!!!!!*

11-18-2005, 09:24 PM	#4 (permalink)
Stu_computer Tech Hardware Team Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 1,459 OS: Windows	Well, there are two different display drivers listed other than that the tsh and bak files are the same. System-bak: display.drv=RADEON VE System-tsh: display.drv=RADEON 7000 SERIES Turn system.ini back on in MSCONFIG then reboot to DOS command prompt only. Execute these 5 commands and reboot. cd windows attrib -h -r system.* ren system.ini system.dud copy system.bak system.ini attrib +h +r system.* If display isn't normal then reinstall video driver. __________________

11-19-2005, 08:18 PM	#9 (permalink)
Stu_computer Tech Hardware Team Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 1,459 OS: Windows	This the file you downloaded? 5-9_wme_dd_cp_26397.exe Go to add/remove programs and remove the ati software then change the video driver to generic vga (select from list). Reboot, should go to normal desktop okay, if not then there is some other problem. Now try the ati setup and reboot, then change settings. __________________

11-20-2005, 09:21 PM	#11 (permalink)
Stu_computer Tech Hardware Team Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 1,459 OS: Windows	Well, that package extracts to C:\ATI\SUPPORT\5-9_wme_dd_cp_26397, if you didn't change the path. So you could do "update driver-have disk" and then navigate to that path. It will then locate an inf file or prompt you none found-you may have to go further into the path till you get the 9X_INF folder. It will show some error message if it's the wrong driver. __________________

11-18-2005, 06:28 PM	#3 (permalink)
jaytechman Registered User Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 62 OS: XP Pro	Geekgirl, Thanks for the advice. Other inquiries have led to a strong suspicion it's a corrupted Display Adapter situation. We even confirmed that by going into MSCONFIG and enabling SYSTEM.INI (making it all normal startup procedures enabled) but going into Advanced and choosing VGA mode, and that enabled a successful boot into normal Windows mode. So, the question now, besides wondering what could have caused the problem, is whether it's more advisable to uninstall and reinstall the display adapter drivers, which have been running fine up until now (no, there are no yellow flags in Device Manger -- it says it's all functioning properly), or to restore a registry backup from a month or so ago (probably no real system configuration changes have occurred since then) using the Run - ScanReg / Restore. It's a business system that I'd rather go the extra mile in being careful about keeping as well maintained as possible. It's an older W98 machine and we're on XP on the main computers in the office, of course, but we still use this one. So, which do you think is more elegant of an approach? Drivers or restore reg? Thanks!

11-18-2005, 11:28 PM	#5 (permalink)
jaytechman Registered User Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 62 OS: XP Pro	I'm not sure which is supposed to be there, VE or 7000. I did try replacing the current SYSTEM.INI file with the TSH file, but I realize from what you're saying that doesn't change anything. Can I just go into Windows Explorer via Safe Mode and rename the files? Or, just edit SYSTEM.INI to make the display driver what BAK has? I'm a bit confused, though. I can't figure what should have made the INI file change... and it's been working fine all along, until I disconnected the monitor for a few weeks. I can probably get a backup of the INI file from a few months ago when I last did a tape backup. Maybe that would be better. While I look into that, I'll look forward to your responses to my above questions. Thanks so much!!!

11-19-2005, 01:29 AM	#6 (permalink)
jaytechman Registered User Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 62 OS: XP Pro	Well, thanks to your comments I recovered a backup of the SYSTEM.INI file from Jan '05 and it's identical to the current version. So, it's not the SYSTEM.INI file (since the machine has worked fine until just recently).

11-20-2005, 02:37 AM	#10 (permalink)
jaytechman Registered User Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 62 OS: XP Pro	Yes, that's the setup file I downloaded. Did Add/Remove of all ATI okay and rebooted. Went to Standard VGA and rebooted okay (without needing VGA Mode set in MSCONFIG Advanced). Then ran ATI Setup with new download and rebooted... but it lost the video (etc?) again halfway through the bootup process, same as it's been doing. What do you think? Thanks again!

11-20-2005, 10:15 PM	#12 (permalink)
jaytechman Registered User Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 62 OS: XP Pro	I actually did try exactly what you suggested, and for some odd reason when I pointed to the 9x_INF folder, even though Windows recognized that it had an INF file in it (it gave me the OK button, which it won't do otherwise), when I did hit OK it said it can't find a correct driver. If I looked in the folder, there are a few INF files, and when I go into the INF using other Have Disk choices there are plenty of Radeon choices, but even after I picked one, it still installed but then said it's not the right driver. And the problem remained after I went ahead and installed it anyway. I've now carefully wiped every trace of ATI and checked that it succeeded. At one point, an installation attempt of the ATI Setup said I should set the video to VGA before doing so. I used the List - Have Disk approach rather than MSCONFIG. Then, after all was very clean, I ran the install again. I was really thorough this time, too. I even deleted all TEMP files/folders beforehand just to be extra safe (I've seen installation routines hang up there on occasion). Same problem still exists. Note that when I go into Add/Remove and try to remove the ATI driver, it has it listed but it says "Error initializing" when I select it and try to proceed. It removes the ATI Control Panel OK and runs the ATI Software Uninstall from Add/Remove Ok as well. But trying ATI driver, which I try "first," doesn't. I'm thinking now that maybe I should wonder about the video card... (I can't find a diagnostic on the ATI CD or web site)... Or try restoring a registry backup... Or, what...? Thanks again! Jay Last edited by jaytechman; 11-20-2005 at 10:19 PM.

11-21-2005, 03:40 AM	#14 (permalink)
jaytechman Registered User Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 62 OS: XP Pro	Somehow I'm pretty sure that's not it. At one point last night after I had wiped all traces of ATI software and drivers from the system and was running Standard VGA, Windows Update told me there's an update for the driver and I let it download the 2002 ATI driver. Same problem! I've now even gone so far as to have removed and replaced the video card. Actually, what I did was this in sequence: - set the display adapter to Standard VGA (seems to take two reboots until that's what shows in Display-Settings-Advanced-Adapter) - Add/Remove to remove all ATI (and reboot) - delete all Windows\Temp files/folders - delete the recent ATI installation folder - remove and reinstall the video card - run the recent ATI setup SAME PROBLEM STILL!!! So, time to replace the video card, do you think? Or what?

11-22-2005, 08:50 PM	#16 (permalink)
Stu_computer Tech Hardware Team Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 1,459 OS: Windows	The problem is specific to the video card not accepting the 32-bit drivers, it works okay in vga mode. I doubt the CMOS battery was the culprit as loss of BIOS and ESCD settings manifest in POST errors, well before windows starts loading. There's no mention of other device problems or having to reset the BIOS settings. At this point it has failed to accept several compatible windows drivers which pretty much indicates the card itself is faulty, perhaps not seated properly, or the card slot is the problem. __________________

11-23-2005, 12:54 AM	#17 (permalink)
jaytechman Registered User Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 62 OS: XP Pro	I've now replaced the video card with a newer one that's compatible with the system and even spoke with ATI tech support to make sure I'm not missing anything. Uninstalled all traces of ATI and then installed their current drivers. Still didn't work. Same problem. I then used the selective approach to isolate the line in System.ini that was preventing the bootup into Windows Normal Mode to complete, and what I found is that if I rem out the following line in the BOOT section it will boot into Normal Mode: display.drv=pnpdrvr.drv However, I've also noticed a few other things as well: - That line definitely existed in the System.ini file that worked fine a year ago so that line isn't really the problem, per se. In fact, my simply going into Device Manger and removing the Radeon driver from Display, and rebooting, caused Windows to put that line back after I had remmed it out! - There has recently been added a line at the bottom of the BOOT section that I've never seen before (but remming it out doesn't solve the problem): original_display.drv=pnpdrvr.drv - Even when it boots successfully into Windows Normal Mode, when I go into the Display - Settings and try to increase the resolution from 640 x 480, the following happens: - Moving the slider to 1024 x 768 only allows the Colors dropdown to be at 16 or 256; if I first set the dropdown to High Color and then drag the slider from 640 x 480 to 1024 x 768, that causes the Colors to revert to 256. And even with that happening and my leaving it at 1024 x 768 with 256 colors, my attempting to Apply that always fails -- the restart brings it right back to where it was: 640 x 480 and 16 colors. (It's a 15" Sony LCD using DVI and it shows up properly under Monitors, so that's probably not it.) By the way: - Nothing jumps out at me as being out of whack in the BIOS (and I agree that I'd be seeing other problems if the battery/BIOS were the problem). - Norton was a problem after the system was off for a while a few months ago but in a very different way: The system wouldn't boot until we disabled or deleted NAV -- an outside tech did it and I don't recall which he did. When I got the system back, I reinstalled NAV and it's worked fine for months ever since. (Not that I have any idea what caused that problem at the time.) So... Maybe it is a bad video card slot? Any other thoughts? Thanks!!! Last edited by jaytechman; 11-23-2005 at 01:00 AM.

11-23-2005, 07:42 AM	#18 (permalink)
Stu_computer Tech Hardware Team Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 1,459 OS: Windows	pnpdrvr.drv is the win9x default video driver. Few things you might look at: 1. make sure [BOOT] is the very first line in system.ini as starting with a blank line can cause problems. 2. check win.ini content as it has display data as well and loads after system.ini so it's remotely possible the error is in win.ini based on system.ini content passed to it. Other than that Gg already had you do the System File Checker routine, you can do a scandisk and reinstalling 98 on top of itself (same directory) to replace all the 98 files on the off chance the vxd is corrupt and a new one fixes the problem. Then reinstall the mobo chipset drivers before doing the video driver. __________________