Poor video card performance???

Lujman · 07-07-2005, 04:12 AM

I'm a new member to this forum and it seems that this place is my last resort

my computer's specs are:
Pentium 4 3ghz
ATI Radeon 9200SE
512mb RAM
Windows XP

I can't remember when the problem began, but its been a while now. Everytime I try to play a game, I get extremely poor performance, even though my computer's specs greatly exceed that of the games' recomnedations.

for example, I play day of defeat, a Half Life mod, very frequently, and I get 30 frames per second, even though I should be able to get a constant 100fps.

Another example: according to the Doom3 booklet, my computer would be the optimum specs to play the game at, yet, when I play it, I average a fps of 15.

This does not only occur in these 2 games, my computer performs extremely poorly with all games that it SHOULD be able to run well.

I have tried everything to find out what the problem is, and I know that it is not viruses that is affecting it, as I have reformatted again and again in an attempt to fix it.

A strange observation I have made with the computer though, is that sometimes when I run DOD, it gives me a constant fps of 100 for the first 5 mins, before dropping back to 30. I have heard that a video card overheating may cause this problem???

I suspect it has something to do with my video card...

CAN ANYONE HELP ME?!

StephenR · 07-07-2005, 06:52 AM

DArN! I had just finished writing this after 10 mins then firefox crashed :(
----------------------

It's overheating if you can see artifacts;

white blobs, characters got lines stretching off them to other things, inverted colours (often purple).

Maybe you need to assign some more memory to the programs, I dunno bout Doom 3 because I haven't got it, but you should be able to do it in DoD, Hl etc cos I've done it too :P

Go into Steam, click properties of the game you want to change, click "Launch Options"

Here you can put "/prefetch:1 -heapsize 128000" (not correctly 128MB but who cares in this case :P)

You could even try -heapsize 256000 if you have enough RAM left without anything running.

BTW make sure you have a pagefile of atleast 1.5 GB with that little RAM, as you're plyaing games.

Prefetch should save you some loading time and perhaps increase the FPS slightly, heapsize assigns more ram to DoD/HL etc. 64MB is default as far as I know (AFAIK), so it's 2x the standard.

I think you are rather short on RAM, as the operating system already uses 1/4 or slightly more of your 512MB of ram...

if you want to debug your problem, and many others, go to www.pcpitstop.com and register.

Here you'll have to do some tests, at the end you will be able to see what problems you have got on your PC and you'll be able to compare your results with other people with similar/same setup.

Something else I recommend is running memtest86 or another version, it's available with knoppix (if you have it, you'll know, otherwise ignore this), or you can download it from here:

http://www.memtest86.com/

Hopefuly I will have helped you with your problem ;)

Greetings,

Stephen

fredchang · 07-07-2005, 10:11 AM

Hey Lujman,

I'm brand new to this website (registered 'bout 2 min. ago) but I have alot of experience in PCs, especially when it comes to performance on a budget. (Please don't prejudice me for my screen name; I am not a bit Asian, and my real name is German!)

Here's my take: running down your system, one thing stands out. 3Ghz P4, more than adequate. 512MB ram, usually enough, but maybe just adequate for WinXP. GFx, Radeon 9200 SE - woah, wait a darn minute! This card has a rusty DX8 GPU (last generation, slow clocks, few pipelines, basic SFx support) paired with an extremely restrictive 64-bit memory interface (as indicated by the "SE" moniker). It may give you (almost) playable (meaning ~30 fps) frame rates with older games (such as the original Half-Life), but is totally crushed by the demands of current games (such as Doom 3) at resolutions as low as 1024x768. This card, while you may have purchased it recently, has already been left in the dust by two - and soon to be three - generations of graphics card technology.

Considering that cards 2x faster can be had for less than $100 and that someone else may use a 9200SE as a basic workstation/TV-out card, I would strongly consider selling your current card.

If you post what settings you are runnung your games at (esp. Doom 3), i can tell you for sure that your card is the performance bottleneck. So please, give resolutions (ie 1024x768), quality level (ie very high), and filtering (ie 8xAA).

elf · 07-07-2005, 02:41 PM

There may be other problems behind the scenes, maybe spyware, or viruses. Before selling anything make sure your system is clean and see if it increases performance any better...ESPECIALLY if it used to work well and it has all of a sudden stopped performing as well.

Please read Greyknight's Anti-Spyware Tutorial for instructions if you are unsure of how to do this.

Lujman · 07-07-2005, 06:54 PM

FredChang:
THANKS for your diagnostic :)
I have been wanting to replace the video card for a LONG time, but I was just worried that the video card wasn't the problem, and that I would waste up to $400 buying a new card even when my computer runs poorly

elf:
I have reformatted twice, and each time again, the performance of the computer is poor.
Surely viruses/spyware will be gone after TWO reformats right?

elf · 07-07-2005, 10:44 PM

More than likely...you just made it sound like you were playing, then one day it just started slowing down, which is a classic symptom of viruses/spyware.

Some spyware can survive formats (supposedly - I've never seen any), but most won't.

fredchang · 07-08-2005, 08:59 AM

Lujman,

Need further proof? I would too if I wanted to dump big moolah into my system. Check out this article at:

http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2146

Or I can just sum it up for ya. Anandtech.com (the best tech website in existance) decided to put a wide array of videocards to the test with Doom 3.

They used an AMD A64 FX53 OCd to high heaven (2.6GHz) w/ 1 gig of ram and the latest drivers. Some of the top-end cards were able to break 70fps at 1600x1200!

But where did your lowly 9200SE land? They tested the reg' 9200 (with double the memory bandwith of the 'SE), and, at the high, high, res' of 800x600, were able to net...drum roll please...

13.7 fps!

This would seem to show, in comparison, that your 9200SE is doing very well for itself at 15fps!

I would definately check the article out for yourself as it covers many videocards that you might look to for a replacement.

I don't know if you checked out my profile; it will tell you that I am a very budget-oriented, OC-lovin' maniac. I spent about $60 for my 9550. I don't know how much money you're looking to spend, but I am thoroughly satisfied with this. With a substantial overclock (250, 200 > 391,225) and the fact that it is a non-SE version, it has turned out to be an extremely worthwile investment. I can detect no jerkiness when I play the Doom 3 demo @1024x768 w/all quality settings and effects on except for filtering. TigerDirect has it now for 49.99 + shipping. but there are plenty of other good options to choose from.

Make sure you get advice from this thread first!

Lujman · 07-08-2005, 08:11 PM

Ok so I'm planning to spend up to 400 aus dollars (roughly 250 euros), what would you recomend I get??? If I can get a good vid card for cheaper, I would.

Also, what does SE stand for? or mean? (I'm guessing **** edition

)

fredchang · 07-09-2005, 02:29 PM

Lujman:

You mustn't've checked my profile. I live in the U.S. of A. What's a euro to me? (I guess I could use a currency calcurator.)

SE? Who knows. Probably Special Edition. Really what it means is that the videocard has half the memory bandwith of its non-SE counterpart, which translates into very poor framerates.

I think that's about $300 USD. In that price range, the best choice by far is the ATI Radeon X800 XL. Check out ZipZoomFly.com; they have the best price, although I'm not sure what hipping charges for you would be.

One last thing: any of the X800 XL chipset cards available from the different vendors (such as ATI, MSI, Sapphire) will do. All of them are pretty much the same. The ATI version is probably the best choice as it's the cheapest.

Lujman · 07-09-2005, 04:29 PM

haha sorry!
you said that you were german in an earlier post, so i guess i assumed you lived in germany!

but anyway, I've scouted around, and I've spotted the GeFroce 6800GT... That looks pretty good for the money, and I can't seem to find a Radeon x800 for around the same price, they're alot more expensive.

Ok, so I've found this GeForce 6800GT for very cheap, and I think its the one I want, but the vendor or manufacturer is unknown... is that something to worry about?

http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI....PcY_BIN_Stores

I've looked around and that is VERY cheap in australia...

ebackhus · 07-10-2005, 02:10 AM

If it's too good to be true, then it probably is. Buy from a trusted retailer and avoid the ones on eBay unless you want to be hosed.

fredchang · 07-10-2005, 12:03 PM

Lujman:

Wait a minute! Ebay? I got no problems with the site, but it's all too easy to get doa equipment without a warranty there.

Are prices in Australia higher than in the US? Multiple websites here list the 6800GT brand new for less than that. I wouldn't consider it a steal.

Earlier I recommended a specific videocard (X800XL) from a specific website (ZipZoomFly.com). I get my prices from Pricegrabber.com. Please check this website out! Navigate to the section on videocards, search for X800XL, then sort the cards by price. Click on the cheapest one; then you get a screen listing all of the different websites that offer the card. Type in your zip code to get shipping costs; then sort the results by BottomLinePrice. Write the price and the website down. Repeat the process, except this time search for 6800GT.

I still recommend the X800XL. It's at the same price point as the 6800GT but has better performance (especially in Doom 3).

If you do find a card at a good price, you can make sure that it isn't too good to be true by going to ResellerRatings.com. Enter in the website name. If the average feedback isn't >=7, choose a different website. >=8 is usually considered safe.

If you can't find something that pleases you, and are willing to trust the Ebay seller's warranty, than it's probably okay to order the 6800GT. But please do lots of homework first!

07-07-2005, 04:12 AM	#1 (permalink)
Lujman Registered User Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 4 OS: Windows XP	Poor video card performance??? I'm a new member to this forum and it seems that this place is my last resort my computer's specs are: Pentium 4 3ghz ATI Radeon 9200SE 512mb RAM Windows XP I can't remember when the problem began, but its been a while now. Everytime I try to play a game, I get extremely poor performance, even though my computer's specs greatly exceed that of the games' recomnedations. for example, I play day of defeat, a Half Life mod, very frequently, and I get 30 frames per second, even though I should be able to get a constant 100fps. Another example: according to the Doom3 booklet, my computer would be the optimum specs to play the game at, yet, when I play it, I average a fps of 15. This does not only occur in these 2 games, my computer performs extremely poorly with all games that it SHOULD be able to run well. I have tried everything to find out what the problem is, and I know that it is not viruses that is affecting it, as I have reformatted again and again in an attempt to fix it. A strange observation I have made with the computer though, is that sometimes when I run DOD, it gives me a constant fps of 100 for the first 5 mins, before dropping back to 30. I have heard that a video card overheating may cause this problem??? I suspect it has something to do with my video card... CAN ANYONE HELP ME?!

07-07-2005, 06:52 AM	#2 (permalink)
StephenR Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 52 OS: Win XP	DArN! I had just finished writing this after 10 mins then firefox crashed :( ---------------------- It's overheating if you can see artifacts; white blobs, characters got lines stretching off them to other things, inverted colours (often purple). Maybe you need to assign some more memory to the programs, I dunno bout Doom 3 because I haven't got it, but you should be able to do it in DoD, Hl etc cos I've done it too :P Go into Steam, click properties of the game you want to change, click "Launch Options" Here you can put "/prefetch:1 -heapsize 128000" (not correctly 128MB but who cares in this case :P) You could even try -heapsize 256000 if you have enough RAM left without anything running. BTW make sure you have a pagefile of atleast 1.5 GB with that little RAM, as you're plyaing games. Prefetch should save you some loading time and perhaps increase the FPS slightly, heapsize assigns more ram to DoD/HL etc. 64MB is default as far as I know (AFAIK), so it's 2x the standard. I think you are rather short on RAM, as the operating system already uses 1/4 or slightly more of your 512MB of ram... if you want to debug your problem, and many others, go to www.pcpitstop.com and register. Here you'll have to do some tests, at the end you will be able to see what problems you have got on your PC and you'll be able to compare your results with other people with similar/same setup. Something else I recommend is running memtest86 or another version, it's available with knoppix (if you have it, you'll know, otherwise ignore this), or you can download it from here: http://www.memtest86.com/ Hopefuly I will have helped you with your problem ;) Greetings, Stephen Last edited by elf; 07-07-2005 at 02:38 PM. Reason: watch your language please

07-07-2005, 10:11 AM	#3 (permalink)
fredchang Registered User Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Cleveland OH Posts: 13 OS: Win2000Pro	Hey Lujman, I'm brand new to this website (registered 'bout 2 min. ago) but I have alot of experience in PCs, especially when it comes to performance on a budget. (Please don't prejudice me for my screen name; I am not a bit Asian, and my real name is German!) Here's my take: running down your system, one thing stands out. 3Ghz P4, more than adequate. 512MB ram, usually enough, but maybe just adequate for WinXP. GFx, Radeon 9200 SE - woah, wait a darn minute! This card has a rusty DX8 GPU (last generation, slow clocks, few pipelines, basic SFx support) paired with an extremely restrictive 64-bit memory interface (as indicated by the "SE" moniker). It may give you (almost) playable (meaning ~30 fps) frame rates with older games (such as the original Half-Life), but is totally crushed by the demands of current games (such as Doom 3) at resolutions as low as 1024x768. This card, while you may have purchased it recently, has already been left in the dust by two - and soon to be three - generations of graphics card technology. Considering that cards 2x faster can be had for less than $100 and that someone else may use a 9200SE as a basic workstation/TV-out card, I would strongly consider selling your current card. If you post what settings you are runnung your games at (esp. Doom 3), i can tell you for sure that your card is the performance bottleneck. So please, give resolutions (ie 1024x768), quality level (ie very high), and filtering (ie 8xAA). Last edited by fredchang; 07-07-2005 at 10:14 AM.

07-07-2005, 02:41 PM	#4 (permalink)
elf Manager, Microsoft Support Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Knoxville, TN or Austin, TX depending Posts: 7,049 OS: WinXP Pro SP3 and Windows 7 My System	There may be other problems behind the scenes, maybe spyware, or viruses. Before selling anything make sure your system is clean and see if it increases performance any better...ESPECIALLY if it used to work well and it has all of a sudden stopped performing as well. Please read Greyknight's Anti-Spyware Tutorial for instructions if you are unsure of how to do this. __________________ If TSF has helped you, Tell us about it! or Donate to help keep the site up! I do not subscribe to threads, so if I stop replying, PM me with a link to your thread so I can find it again. Last edited by elf; 07-07-2005 at 02:43 PM.

07-07-2005, 10:44 PM	#6 (permalink)
elf Manager, Microsoft Support Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Knoxville, TN or Austin, TX depending Posts: 7,049 OS: WinXP Pro SP3 and Windows 7 My System	More than likely...you just made it sound like you were playing, then one day it just started slowing down, which is a classic symptom of viruses/spyware. Some spyware can survive formats (supposedly - I've never seen any), but most won't. __________________ If TSF has helped you, Tell us about it! or Donate to help keep the site up! I do not subscribe to threads, so if I stop replying, PM me with a link to your thread so I can find it again.

07-07-2005, 06:54 PM	#5 (permalink)
Lujman Registered User Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 4 OS: Windows XP	FredChang: THANKS for your diagnostic :) I have been wanting to replace the video card for a LONG time, but I was just worried that the video card wasn't the problem, and that I would waste up to $400 buying a new card even when my computer runs poorly elf: I have reformatted twice, and each time again, the performance of the computer is poor. Surely viruses/spyware will be gone after TWO reformats right?

07-08-2005, 08:59 AM	#7 (permalink)
fredchang Registered User Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Cleveland OH Posts: 13 OS: Win2000Pro	Lujman, Need further proof? I would too if I wanted to dump big moolah into my system. Check out this article at: http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2146 Or I can just sum it up for ya. Anandtech.com (the best tech website in existance) decided to put a wide array of videocards to the test with Doom 3. They used an AMD A64 FX53 OCd to high heaven (2.6GHz) w/ 1 gig of ram and the latest drivers. Some of the top-end cards were able to break 70fps at 1600x1200! But where did your lowly 9200SE land? They tested the reg' 9200 (with double the memory bandwith of the 'SE), and, at the high, high, res' of 800x600, were able to net...drum roll please... 13.7 fps! This would seem to show, in comparison, that your 9200SE is doing very well for itself at 15fps! I would definately check the article out for yourself as it covers many videocards that you might look to for a replacement. I don't know if you checked out my profile; it will tell you that I am a very budget-oriented, OC-lovin' maniac. I spent about $60 for my 9550. I don't know how much money you're looking to spend, but I am thoroughly satisfied with this. With a substantial overclock (250, 200 > 391,225) and the fact that it is a non-SE version, it has turned out to be an extremely worthwile investment. I can detect no jerkiness when I play the Doom 3 demo @1024x768 w/all quality settings and effects on except for filtering. TigerDirect has it now for 49.99 + shipping. but there are plenty of other good options to choose from. Make sure you get advice from this thread first!

07-08-2005, 08:11 PM	#8 (permalink)
Lujman Registered User Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 4 OS: Windows XP	Ok so I'm planning to spend up to 400 aus dollars (roughly 250 euros), what would you recomend I get??? If I can get a good vid card for cheaper, I would. Also, what does SE stand for? or mean? (I'm guessing **** edition )

07-09-2005, 02:29 PM	#9 (permalink)
fredchang Registered User Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Cleveland OH Posts: 13 OS: Win2000Pro	Lujman: You mustn't've checked my profile. I live in the U.S. of A. What's a euro to me? (I guess I could use a currency calcurator.) SE? Who knows. Probably Special Edition. Really what it means is that the videocard has half the memory bandwith of its non-SE counterpart, which translates into very poor framerates. I think that's about $300 USD. In that price range, the best choice by far is the ATI Radeon X800 XL. Check out ZipZoomFly.com; they have the best price, although I'm not sure what hipping charges for you would be. One last thing: any of the X800 XL chipset cards available from the different vendors (such as ATI, MSI, Sapphire) will do. All of them are pretty much the same. The ATI version is probably the best choice as it's the cheapest. Last edited by fredchang; 07-09-2005 at 02:47 PM.

07-09-2005, 04:29 PM	#10 (permalink)
Lujman Registered User Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 4 OS: Windows XP	haha sorry! you said that you were german in an earlier post, so i guess i assumed you lived in germany! but anyway, I've scouted around, and I've spotted the GeFroce 6800GT... That looks pretty good for the money, and I can't seem to find a Radeon x800 for around the same price, they're alot more expensive. Ok, so I've found this GeForce 6800GT for very cheap, and I think its the one I want, but the vendor or manufacturer is unknown... is that something to worry about? http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI....PcY_BIN_Stores I've looked around and that is VERY cheap in australia...

07-10-2005, 02:10 AM	#11 (permalink)
ebackhus Manager, Design Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: SATX Posts: 14,341 OS: WinXP Pro SP3/Windows 7 RTM My System Blog Entries: 28	If it's too good to be true, then it probably is. Buy from a trusted retailer and avoid the ones on eBay unless you want to be hosed. __________________ ----------------------------- There are no dumb questions, unless a customer is asking them. Help in the fight against cancer and other serious illnesses.

07-10-2005, 12:03 PM	#12 (permalink)
fredchang Registered User Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Cleveland OH Posts: 13 OS: Win2000Pro	Lujman: Wait a minute! Ebay? I got no problems with the site, but it's all too easy to get doa equipment without a warranty there. Are prices in Australia higher than in the US? Multiple websites here list the 6800GT brand new for less than that. I wouldn't consider it a steal. Earlier I recommended a specific videocard (X800XL) from a specific website (ZipZoomFly.com). I get my prices from Pricegrabber.com. Please check this website out! Navigate to the section on videocards, search for X800XL, then sort the cards by price. Click on the cheapest one; then you get a screen listing all of the different websites that offer the card. Type in your zip code to get shipping costs; then sort the results by BottomLinePrice. Write the price and the website down. Repeat the process, except this time search for 6800GT. I still recommend the X800XL. It's at the same price point as the 6800GT but has better performance (especially in Doom 3). If you do find a card at a good price, you can make sure that it isn't too good to be true by going to ResellerRatings.com. Enter in the website name. If the average feedback isn't >=7, choose a different website. >=8 is usually considered safe. If you can't find something that pleases you, and are willing to trust the Ebay seller's warranty, than it's probably okay to order the 6800GT. But please do lots of homework first!