Video card questions

Blazer1 · 12-01-2008, 10:24 AM

Hello,
I have several questions, some specific and some general, about my computer and a flight simulator requirements. Let me warn you I know very little about computers. Here is my system;

Windows XP
Dell XPS410
Intel Dual core 6400 @ 2.33GHz
1.00GB of RAM
ATI Radeon X1300PRO 256MB
375w power supply

Here are the simulator requirements;

Minimum Recommended System:
Some graphical features may be disabled. Aerodynamic calculations will remain high quality.

Windows* XP or Windows* Vista®
Intel® Pentium® 1.0GHz or equivalent
512 MB RAM
4 GB Hard Drive Space
DVD Drive
3D Accelerated Video with:
32 MB Dedicated Video Memory
Full Windows DirectX® 9 compliant (Pixel Shader 1.4 support)
Optimal System:
For best graphical performance.
Dual Core 2.4GHz CPU
2 GB RAM
3D Accelerated Video with:
512 MB dedicated video memory
(Pixel Shader 3.0 support)
Multiplayer Requirements

Now for some more general questions. My computer is about three years old, if needed should I upgrade this one or start over? I do not mind spending a couple of hundred dollars on a power supply and GPU if my system is worth upgrading. How much difference would there be if I upgraded my current GPU with a Radeon 3870 HD?

Thank you!

macroman · 12-01-2008, 11:44 AM

things have moved a long way in three years ,if you can I would start over but first I would read up on whats good before you get a new one

Blazer1 · 12-01-2008, 11:49 AM

I assume this means my computer will not run this program?

macroman · 12-01-2008, 11:51 AM

it will but at low level ,slow

Blazer1 · 12-01-2008, 11:56 AM

Would an upgrade in gpu and power supply help or is it my entire system is bad?

macroman · 12-01-2008, 12:00 PM

by no way ,more ram will help the most and a fast HD

Blazer1 · 12-01-2008, 12:33 PM

Should I just trash the entire tower and start over, is anything usable? I hate to throw away a working computer but I don't want to spend more re-building this one than buying a new one.

macroman · 12-01-2008, 12:41 PM

your computer is not bad and will work for years to come all it needs is more ram and a better HD

I still have a 600pro vc (thats the one before your one ) thats works great but I do have 4gig of ram and 2 7200 500gig HD in it

**magnethead** · 12-01-2008, 01:03 PM

a 3850, Corsair TX or HX 650 or Real Power Pro 650, a pair of 1GB DDR-800 PC2-6400 RAM sticks, and you should be set. HDD speed doesnt have that great of effect in gaming really.

Blazer1 · 12-01-2008, 01:04 PM

Okay, I can work with that. So I need to shop for some ram and a new HD then up-grade gpu and power supply? How do you know my HD is slow, am not second guessing you just curious as I did not list anything about my HD. What about my cpu is it okay? How much ram should I add, 1 more gig for a total of 2 gig? I am leaning towards a Radeon HD 3870 gpu, it this a good choice?

I just noticed your post Magnethead, what do you think of my gpu choice above?

**magnethead** · 12-01-2008, 02:01 PM

I think macro is assuming you have a 5000 RPM drive, but I'm willing to bet it's 7200. Very few 5000's are made anymore. And if you do have a 5000, I haven't found that the latency is much different on a slower drive in gaming.

I would say if you're willing to spend, a 3870 is great, but if you're on a budget, the 3850 is good as well.

For dual channel to work, both sticks should be identical...so a pair of 1 GB sticks is preferred.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814102794 3850 $90

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...9005&Tpk=650tx 650tx $95 (cyber monday sale has MIR)

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820227189 $22

Blazer1 · 12-01-2008, 02:23 PM

No, I do not have a budget per say but do like doing things right the first time.

It seems that I will be spending + or - $100 for a gpu. I am not going to worry about one card being $90 when a much better one is $120.

Here is what I am thinking,
gpu-$110 (Sapphire HD 3870?) is this a good choice
power supply-$75 don't have a clue if this is enough money or what a good one is?
Ram-$25 is there a difference, need some help here also

What kind of improvements will I see, will there be a $200 improvement?
How about installing this, is this something I could do?

**magnethead** · 12-01-2008, 02:59 PM

The 3870 is a good choice. But it retails for closer to $140 it seems. But it would be better for what you're doing.

The RAM I linked to will work with you computer, and is about as cheap as you'll get it.

I'm assuming the XPS 410 is ATX. If it's BTX, there could be a power issue.

Blazer1 · 12-01-2008, 03:30 PM

This card, http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814102719

This memory,
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820134584

What is a good power supply?

I am not sure how to answer your question about ATX or BTX? Where do I look to find this information?

**magnethead** · 12-01-2008, 04:07 PM

that card is on backorder, but it's good.

I can't guarantee you that the RAM will run in dual channel unless the stick you have now is also a kinston 1 GB stick with the same timings (assuming 5-5-5-15).

I linked to a good power supply.

**magnethead** · 12-01-2008, 04:08 PM

The image on google shows it as a BTX.

It has the white case with the fan opening right behind it, and a top mounted power supply?

Blazer1 · 12-01-2008, 04:15 PM

Yes the case is white sides silver front. I can't see the back to tell for sure where the power supply is but the power cable goes in the top, does this mean the power supply is in the top?

When you mentioned adding ram did you mean add 1GB stick for a total of 2GB (counting the 1gb already installed) or did you intend for me to add 2gb for a total of 3gb?

What about installing these parts? Is this something I can do with you all helping?

By the way, thanks alot for the help!

**magnethead** · 12-01-2008, 04:27 PM

no, 2 GB overall. RAM works MUCH faster in identical pairs of 2.

Yes, your computer is a BTX (it will take dell ALOT of something to make us forgive them for going BTX). The PSU's are a different size and normal supplies will not fit. Dell has a 650W that will fit but want way too much money for it. I THINK somebody on the forum found how how to make an ATX fit in a BTX hole but not sure.

**magnethead** · 12-01-2008, 07:19 PM

ok after some conversation back in the mods room, the stated ATX PSU will fit your rig. However, some case modiciation is needed. The stock dell has the power cord enter on the opposite side as the corsair (to be more specific, no mass produced PSU has the cord go in like dell does). Depending on how much the case interferes, you may need to move or remove a section of case material.

Blazer1 · 12-01-2008, 07:22 PM

Why would Dell use an odd ball power supply???? Do they think we are so brand loyal we like paying more than necessary for hardware?

So where does this leave me? Throw in all the components other than the power supply and relish in the fact when and if it burns down I will be more educated in my computer knowledge avoid Dell like the plague?

12-01-2008, 10:24 AM	#1 (permalink)
Blazer1 Registered User Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 43 OS: XP	Video card questions Hello, I have several questions, some specific and some general, about my computer and a flight simulator requirements. Let me warn you I know very little about computers. Here is my system; Windows XP Dell XPS410 Intel Dual core 6400 @ 2.33GHz 1.00GB of RAM ATI Radeon X1300PRO 256MB 375w power supply Here are the simulator requirements; Minimum Recommended System: Some graphical features may be disabled. Aerodynamic calculations will remain high quality. Windows* XP or Windows* Vista® Intel® Pentium® 1.0GHz or equivalent 512 MB RAM 4 GB Hard Drive Space DVD Drive 3D Accelerated Video with: 32 MB Dedicated Video Memory Full Windows DirectX® 9 compliant (Pixel Shader 1.4 support) Optimal System: For best graphical performance. Dual Core 2.4GHz CPU 2 GB RAM 3D Accelerated Video with: 512 MB dedicated video memory (Pixel Shader 3.0 support) Multiplayer Requirements Now for some more general questions. My computer is about three years old, if needed should I upgrade this one or start over? I do not mind spending a couple of hundred dollars on a power supply and GPU if my system is worth upgrading. How much difference would there be if I upgraded my current GPU with a Radeon 3870 HD? Thank you!

12-01-2008, 11:44 AM	#2 (permalink)
macroman Registered User Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 148 OS: Windows 7,Vista	Re: Video card questions things have moved a long way in three years ,if you can I would start over but first I would read up on whats good before you get a new one

12-01-2008, 11:49 AM	#3 (permalink)
Blazer1 Registered User Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 43 OS: XP	Re: Video card questions I assume this means my computer will not run this program?

12-01-2008, 11:51 AM	#4 (permalink)
macroman Registered User Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 148 OS: Windows 7,Vista	Re: Video card questions it will but at low level ,slow

12-01-2008, 11:56 AM	#5 (permalink)
Blazer1 Registered User Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 43 OS: XP	Re: Video card questions Would an upgrade in gpu and power supply help or is it my entire system is bad?

12-01-2008, 12:00 PM	#6 (permalink)
macroman Registered User Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 148 OS: Windows 7,Vista	Re: Video card questions by no way ,more ram will help the most and a fast HD

12-01-2008, 12:33 PM	#7 (permalink)
Blazer1 Registered User Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 43 OS: XP	Re: Video card questions Should I just trash the entire tower and start over, is anything usable? I hate to throw away a working computer but I don't want to spend more re-building this one than buying a new one.

12-01-2008, 12:41 PM	#8 (permalink)
macroman Registered User Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 148 OS: Windows 7,Vista	Re: Video card questions your computer is not bad and will work for years to come all it needs is more ram and a better HD I still have a 600pro vc (thats the one before your one ) thats works great but I do have 4gig of ram and 2 7200 500gig HD in it Last edited by macroman; 12-01-2008 at 12:45 PM.

12-01-2008, 01:03 PM	#9 (permalink)
magnethead Registered User Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Texas, USA Posts: 3,568 OS: Vista ultimate 32bit My System Blog Entries: 3	Re: Video card questions a 3850, Corsair TX or HX 650 or Real Power Pro 650, a pair of 1GB DDR-800 PC2-6400 RAM sticks, and you should be set. HDD speed doesnt have that great of effect in gaming really. __________________ For proper support: what are you running? graphics, cpu, m/board, ram, PSU brand wattage PCI-E requires 26 amps at 12 volts. That's a 650W PSU. Power Supply Info and Selection . Info on thermal compounds & application . TEST PSU USING MULTI-METER . Bench Testing Your System

12-01-2008, 01:04 PM	#10 (permalink)
Blazer1 Registered User Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 43 OS: XP	Re: Video card questions Okay, I can work with that. So I need to shop for some ram and a new HD then up-grade gpu and power supply? How do you know my HD is slow, am not second guessing you just curious as I did not list anything about my HD. What about my cpu is it okay? How much ram should I add, 1 more gig for a total of 2 gig? I am leaning towards a Radeon HD 3870 gpu, it this a good choice? I just noticed your post Magnethead, what do you think of my gpu choice above? Last edited by Blazer1; 12-01-2008 at 01:06 PM.

12-01-2008, 02:01 PM	#11 (permalink)
magnethead Registered User Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Texas, USA Posts: 3,568 OS: Vista ultimate 32bit My System Blog Entries: 3	Re: Video card questions I think macro is assuming you have a 5000 RPM drive, but I'm willing to bet it's 7200. Very few 5000's are made anymore. And if you do have a 5000, I haven't found that the latency is much different on a slower drive in gaming. I would say if you're willing to spend, a 3870 is great, but if you're on a budget, the 3850 is good as well. For dual channel to work, both sticks should be identical...so a pair of 1 GB sticks is preferred. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814102794 3850 $90 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...9005&Tpk=650tx 650tx $95 (cyber monday sale has MIR) http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820227189 $22 __________________ For proper support: what are you running? graphics, cpu, m/board, ram, PSU brand wattage PCI-E requires 26 amps at 12 volts. That's a 650W PSU. Power Supply Info and Selection . Info on thermal compounds & application . TEST PSU USING MULTI-METER . Bench Testing Your System

12-01-2008, 02:23 PM	#12 (permalink)
Blazer1 Registered User Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 43 OS: XP	Re: Video card questions No, I do not have a budget per say but do like doing things right the first time. It seems that I will be spending + or - $100 for a gpu. I am not going to worry about one card being $90 when a much better one is $120. Here is what I am thinking, gpu-$110 (Sapphire HD 3870?) is this a good choice power supply-$75 don't have a clue if this is enough money or what a good one is? Ram-$25 is there a difference, need some help here also What kind of improvements will I see, will there be a $200 improvement? How about installing this, is this something I could do?

12-01-2008, 02:59 PM	#13 (permalink)
magnethead Registered User Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Texas, USA Posts: 3,568 OS: Vista ultimate 32bit My System Blog Entries: 3	Re: Video card questions The 3870 is a good choice. But it retails for closer to $140 it seems. But it would be better for what you're doing. The RAM I linked to will work with you computer, and is about as cheap as you'll get it. I'm assuming the XPS 410 is ATX. If it's BTX, there could be a power issue. __________________ For proper support: what are you running? graphics, cpu, m/board, ram, PSU brand wattage PCI-E requires 26 amps at 12 volts. That's a 650W PSU. Power Supply Info and Selection . Info on thermal compounds & application . TEST PSU USING MULTI-METER . Bench Testing Your System

12-01-2008, 03:30 PM	#14 (permalink)
Blazer1 Registered User Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 43 OS: XP	Re: Video card questions This card, http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814102719 This memory, http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820134584 What is a good power supply? I am not sure how to answer your question about ATX or BTX? Where do I look to find this information?

12-01-2008, 04:07 PM	#15 (permalink)
magnethead Registered User Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Texas, USA Posts: 3,568 OS: Vista ultimate 32bit My System Blog Entries: 3	Re: Video card questions that card is on backorder, but it's good. I can't guarantee you that the RAM will run in dual channel unless the stick you have now is also a kinston 1 GB stick with the same timings (assuming 5-5-5-15). I linked to a good power supply. __________________ For proper support: what are you running? graphics, cpu, m/board, ram, PSU brand wattage PCI-E requires 26 amps at 12 volts. That's a 650W PSU. Power Supply Info and Selection . Info on thermal compounds & application . TEST PSU USING MULTI-METER . Bench Testing Your System

12-01-2008, 04:08 PM	#16 (permalink)
magnethead Registered User Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Texas, USA Posts: 3,568 OS: Vista ultimate 32bit My System Blog Entries: 3	Re: Video card questions The image on google shows it as a BTX. It has the white case with the fan opening right behind it, and a top mounted power supply? __________________ For proper support: what are you running? graphics, cpu, m/board, ram, PSU brand wattage PCI-E requires 26 amps at 12 volts. That's a 650W PSU. Power Supply Info and Selection . Info on thermal compounds & application . TEST PSU USING MULTI-METER . Bench Testing Your System

12-01-2008, 04:15 PM	#17 (permalink)
Blazer1 Registered User Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 43 OS: XP	Re: Video card questions Yes the case is white sides silver front. I can't see the back to tell for sure where the power supply is but the power cable goes in the top, does this mean the power supply is in the top? When you mentioned adding ram did you mean add 1GB stick for a total of 2GB (counting the 1gb already installed) or did you intend for me to add 2gb for a total of 3gb? What about installing these parts? Is this something I can do with you all helping? By the way, thanks alot for the help! Last edited by Blazer1; 12-01-2008 at 04:17 PM.

12-01-2008, 04:27 PM	#18 (permalink)
magnethead Registered User Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Texas, USA Posts: 3,568 OS: Vista ultimate 32bit My System Blog Entries: 3	Re: Video card questions no, 2 GB overall. RAM works MUCH faster in identical pairs of 2. Yes, your computer is a BTX (it will take dell ALOT of something to make us forgive them for going BTX). The PSU's are a different size and normal supplies will not fit. Dell has a 650W that will fit but want way too much money for it. I THINK somebody on the forum found how how to make an ATX fit in a BTX hole but not sure. __________________ For proper support: what are you running? graphics, cpu, m/board, ram, PSU brand wattage PCI-E requires 26 amps at 12 volts. That's a 650W PSU. Power Supply Info and Selection . Info on thermal compounds & application . TEST PSU USING MULTI-METER . Bench Testing Your System

12-01-2008, 07:19 PM	#19 (permalink)
magnethead Registered User Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Texas, USA Posts: 3,568 OS: Vista ultimate 32bit My System Blog Entries: 3	Re: Video card questions ok after some conversation back in the mods room, the stated ATX PSU will fit your rig. However, some case modiciation is needed. The stock dell has the power cord enter on the opposite side as the corsair (to be more specific, no mass produced PSU has the cord go in like dell does). Depending on how much the case interferes, you may need to move or remove a section of case material. __________________ For proper support: what are you running? graphics, cpu, m/board, ram, PSU brand wattage PCI-E requires 26 amps at 12 volts. That's a 650W PSU. Power Supply Info and Selection . Info on thermal compounds & application . TEST PSU USING MULTI-METER . Bench Testing Your System

12-01-2008, 07:22 PM	#20 (permalink)
Blazer1 Registered User Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 43 OS: XP	Re: Video card questions Why would Dell use an odd ball power supply???? Do they think we are so brand loyal we like paying more than necessary for hardware? So where does this leave me? Throw in all the components other than the power supply and relish in the fact when and if it burns down I will be more educated in my computer knowledge avoid Dell like the plague?