AznKenshin

I was very worried before I read this thread. In fact, the EVGA Customer Support kindly led me to this! I am almost certain this could be the decisive solution to my problem. This is my story:

"Since winter of 2007, I had a SAPPHIRE x1950PRO that had a few problems occasionally. Games would freeze in-game and then followed by a black screen. I became tired of this problem and decided to purchase a new video card: the EVGA 8800GTS 512MB. I received it today and installed it in the PC. However, the monitor was black as if there was no signal received. I opened the PC and re-seated the card. No luck. I even readjusted the position of my motherboard to make sure it would allow the video card to be seated properly. I tried it once again and still the black screen. I became apprehensive and called EVGA immediately. They told me my video card could be defective. They told me to try removing the CMOS battery and replace it again after 10 minutes of wait. I tried it again, but still the black screen. However, I tried it with my old x1950PRO and it worked just fine (aside from re-installing drivers)."

My specs:

MSI K9A Platinum
SAPPHIRE x1950PRO (working) and EVGA 8800GTS 512 (needs BIOS flash)
OCZ GameXStream 600W
PATRIOT 1GB DDR800 x2

MSI quickly replied and told me the GPU may need to be flashed with a BIOS so that it is compatible with a PCI-e 1.0 slot in my motherboard. I called EVGA to verify this and that is how I got to this thread.


Now, for my important question:

I do not have access to another motherboard which I can flash my 8800GTS 512. The only way is to use my working SAPPHIRE x1950PRO in one slot (to boot up Windows XP) and have my 8800GTS 512 in the other PCI-e slot. Will I be able to selectively flash my 8800GTS 512 even when another card is occupying the other PCI-e slot? (Should I have them both connected to a 6-pin? Or just one? If so, which?)

Thank you for your time and I look forward to a definitive solution!

UncleMacro

The video BIOS flash utilities that I've used have been DOS based but it's probably the same for Windows utilities. They allow you to specify which video card to flash. "0" is usually the primary card and "1" is the next card but that will vary from program to program. I'd get the flash utility they suggest you use and make sure it has this feature. It's common to use one functioning card to flash the BIOS on another malfunctioning card so I'd assume all flash utilities support it. But check the documentation first before doing it.

And yes, you need to plug a 6 pin PCI-Express power cable into each card.

AznKenshin

So, you're saying I can flash my GPU without booting to Windows XP? Well, the problem is I can't even see anything on my screen if I'm booting with 8800GTS 512. However, booting with x1950PRO works.

Will booting both of them installed in my mobo work? If so, can I selectively update the BIOS of ONLY the 8800GTS?

By the way, this is the link to the BIOS update by EVGA: http://www.evga.com/forums/tm.asp?m=224162&mpage=1&key=

FreoHeaveho

1. Install the X1950pro card only.
   
2. Download (to your desktop) this (but dont install yet): http://us.download.nvidia.com/Window...glish_whql.exe
   
3. Download the bios update (but dont install yet): ftp://ftp.evga.com/bios/N841%20Update%201.1.zip
   
4. Download and install this: http://downloads.guru3d.com/download.php?det=745
   
5. Completely remove NVIDIA and ATi display drivers from Add/Remove programs
   
6. Run Driver Cleaner and use it for ATi and nVidia drivers
   
7. Shutdown (not restart)
   
8. Remove the ATi card and install the nVidia card (8800GTS)
   
9. Restart PC in safe mode (tap F8 on restart)
   
10. Make sure no programs are running in the background, and double click update.exe from the extracted .zip file
    
11. Press “Y” to begin flash
    
12. After flash restart PC in safe mode
    
13. Install the nVidia driver downloaded at number 2.
    
14. Restart normally and post result.

UncleMacro

You'll have to ask the guy at EVGA if their program can do it. They're running a Windows updater with the BIOS file embedded in it. Generally they're picky about only updating a previous version of the BIOS so it would only flash the card you want but I'd ask EVGA first. Windows updaters usually just start a command line box and then run a command line version of the updater with default options you can't set.

If their Windows updater doesn't do it by default then there's another option. If you scroll down the link you gave me you'll see some posts from a user named Mavke. He's an expert on video card flashing (way more than me). His site is www.mvktech.net . It's the standard place to get video BIOSes. He has extracted the BIOS file embedded within EVGA Windows program at the bottom of this page this page. That's the BIOS file you need. Then you can run NVFlash from a bootable DOS disk without booting Windows. Assuming you know some old DOS stuff: all you have to do is stick the 8800 GTS into the machine and have it boot to DOS with NVFlash called from the autoexec.bat. I believe that will run it even though you can't see the screen. I say "I believe" because I assume that DOS will boot even if it doesn't see a display adapter. You'll have to copy the BIOS file onto the DOS disk and then have autoexec.bat call NVFlash with the appropriate command line parameters. There's a basic NVFlash guide on this page.

Always back up your existing BIOS before flashing it to a new one. You could rig a DOS disk to run NVFlash and have it make a copy of your current BIOS. If it creates the file then you'll know that everything is working properly. Then you can change the NVFlash params in autoexec.bat to have it flash the BIOS. This page shows the screenshot when you run NVFlash with no parameters. It displays a list of the basic commands (there are more off in a readme file).

If all that seems like too much work then I'd just ask the EVGA guy if their Windows updater will do this automatically. Your other card is an ATI so normally EVGAs Windows flash utility would ignore it and only change the NVIDIA card. These kinds of programs are normally rigged to be very picky about checking for the right card before updating them but it's best to check. If you want to do it without waiting for a response from EVGA then the DOS approach will do the trick (but it's a bit more involved).

AznKenshin

Thanks for the step-by-step, bigfella. It was very easy to follow. However, I cannot do safe mode because I can't even SEE. The monitor is showing only a black screen when I boot with my 8800GTS 512.

@UncleMacro
I didn't really understand what you meant. If you could put it in silghtly easier terms, I would greatly appreciate it!

UncleMacro

If you're willing to be a bit patient you can ask the EVGA guy on that forum and I would expect the answer will be that the Windows updater will only update your 8800 and ignore the ATI card. If you don't want to wait for an answer then you'll need a floppy disk to do the DOS version. At least that's the easiest way. You could also make a bootable CD-ROM and I assume a bootable flash drive. But you'll need to be able to boot DOS to do it. Do you want to go the DOS route with a floppy drive or wait for EVGA?

FreoHeaveho

By all means follow Uncle's advice, however if you want to try out what i said, you could use the ATi card to boot, then use the msconfig (in run) to set the next boot to safe mode. Then follow the rest of my instrucitons.

UncleMacro

He can't see anything in safe mode. He has a motherboard incompatibility (NVIDIA PCI-Express 2.0 versus PCI-Express 1.0 motherboard) so he has to do everything completely blind if running only with the 8800. He didn't say whether it was actually booting to Windows with only the 8800.

AznKenshin

Okay, so I have two options to consider. But bigfella, even if I did msconfig to boot to Safe mode, how will I be able to run the programs you told me to do -- I wouldn't be able to see anything.

AznKenshin

Actually, I don't think I can even BOOT to Windows, even when blind. About 20 seconds after booting, my Num Lock, Caps Lock, and Scroll Lock lights blink in unison every 15 seconds. That's very unusual. What do you guys think? If I waited about 2 minutes or so, would I end up in Windows?

What could the three blinking Lock lights mean?

UncleMacro

I don't know about the blinking lights but if you don't get the Windows startup sound then you're not in Windows (or you don't have speakers). Judging from your gaming oriented hardware I assume you can hear the Windows startup sound.

AznKenshin

I will try to wait for that sound. I'll let you know when I boot with my 8800GTS again.

At any rate, I've posted my question in easier terms. Hopefully I'll get an answer soon: http://www.evga.com/forums/tm.asp?m=...4&key=&#304235

By the way, thank you so much for your time and support.

UncleMacro

No problem.

I'd bet the answer from EVGA is that it will ignore the ATI card and just flash the NVIDIA card but I'd still wait for their answer.

AznKenshin

Okay, I called EVGA and they told me it could simply be my card that's malfunctioning. I see the 8800GTS fan spinning, but I don't see video being churned out from the card.

Unfortunately, he didn't answer my question about the ability to selectively target the 8800GTS when using the BIOS update.

UncleMacro

It could just be a dead card. But if you're trying to put an NVIDIA PCI-Express 2.0 video card into a PCI-Express 1.0 motherboard then you always have to consider the possibility of the PCI-Express incompatibility problem. Some people have the problem and some people don't. But it's common enough that I'd trying flashing the BIOS before returning the card. Otherwise you could get a new card and have it give you a black screen. A video BIOS flash isn't really a big deal. I admit the DOS approach may sound a little complicated to people who haven't DOSed that much. My first PC was an original IBM brand PC with floppies and no hard disk so I have lots of DOS experience.

AznKenshin

I have little to no experience of DOS, in fact I can't recall the last time I did that. If you could give me easy step-by-step instructions, that would work also. However, wouldn't DOS require you to be able to see the screen? How will I be able to do that on my "malfunctioning" card -- it gives a black screen.

UncleMacro

It's called "blind flashing". I don't think I've ever had to do it but it can be done. I'm just not 100% sure DOS will boot if you have the PCI-Express compatibility problem. I assume it would but I just know DOS will boot without a video card with older hardware.

The general steps for blind flashing are:

• 1) Make a DOS boot disk (usually a floppy disk). www.bootdisk.com has BIOS flashing bootdisks preconfigured for you. They're easy to make.
• 2) Put the BIOS .ROM file and NVFlash.exe onto the boot disk.
• 3) Create an autoexec.bat file which contains a line which executes NVFlash to save your current BIOS. autoexec.bat runs automatically after DOS boots. It contains the command which runs NVFlash. You don't have to see the screen. It just runs by itself after DOS boots and runs NVFlash for you.
• 4) Boot the disk and make sure it saves the old BIOS so you know everything is working properly.
• 5) If it saved the old BIOS then change autoexec.bat to flash the BIOS .ROM file.
• 6) Boot the disk and cross your fingers.

The other way to do it (as best as I can recall) is that you can manually tell NVFlash which video card to flash. So you'd boot with both video cards in the machine and then just type in the DOS commands for NVFlash which tell it which card to flash. At least that's how you handle it when you have two NVIDIA cards. Your main card would be an ATI so NVFlash probably won't see it at all anyway.

AznKenshin

Seems complicated. If you have time, I was wondering if you could combine or let me skip some steps by doing the first ones. They seem complicated to me...

Otherwise, I'll try doing it myself. Or simply wait for tomorrow when I get to try my GPU on a different motherboard.

UncleMacro

The test you're suggesting is only definitive if you test it in a PCI-Express 1.1 or 2.0 motherboard. It should be compatible with those motherboards without a video BIOS flash. If it boots with one of those then you know the video card isn't dead.

But it may or may not boot with a PCI-Express 1.0 motherboard. As far as I know some 1.0 motherboards have the problem and others don't. If it boots you know it's not dead. If it doesn't boot then you're still not sure about the cause.

If the DOS thing intimidates you (I don't blame you - DOS is arcane) then you can just wait for EVGA. It's highly likely they'll just tell you to run the Windows flash program with both cards installed. If that doesn't pan out then I can walk you through the whole DOS business.

If you like, you can go ahead and make a DOS boot disk and see if it boots with your 8800. Just download this program and execute it. It will prompt you to insert a formatted floppy disk. Then you just reboot to the floppy disk. The floppy disk will have to be the first boot device in your motherboard BIOS to boot from the floppy. You can try it with your X1950 to see how it works and then try to boot it with your 8800.