Upgrading my PC, question about FSB's and RAM.

daveyp · 11-21-2008, 03:41 PM

I'm thinking of upgrading my PC to an Intel Core 2 Duo E8400, as having looked at benchmarks on Tom's Hardware it seems like a very good all round CPU.

With this I would also have to replace my motherboard and RAM, which I'm fine with, however because of the 1333 FSB it looks like I'm going to need DDR3 ram and a compatible motherboard. This is turning out more expensive than I was looking for (I was shooting for around £250). Another limiting factor is that I'm currently using a M-ATX form factor case and want to stick with it.

I was wondering if it is possible to run this CPU at a lower FSB and therefore go for DDR2 ram and a compatible M-ATX motherboard to save money and if that is worth doing? Or should I just go for a CPU with a lower FSB?

Current Setup:
CPU
AMD Athlon 64, 2000 MHz, 3200+
Motherboard
MSI Amethyst-M
Ram - 1792 MB (DDR SDRAM)
Hynix - 256 MB PC3200 DDR SDRAM
Samsung - 256 MB PC2700 DDR SDRAM
Nanya - 256 MB PC2700 DDR SDRAM
Kingston K 0 1 GB PC3200 DDR SDRAM
Graphics Card
NVIDIA GeForce 8800 GTS (640 MB)
Monitor
Samsung SyncMaster
Hard Drive
Western Digital SATA 300gb
PSU
OCZ GameXStream 600

**wrench97** · 11-21-2008, 04:29 PM

Motherboard yes you will need to change DDR3 you don't need or want Intel Memory buss and Cpu FSB are different from AMD Good P43 or P45 board and DDR2 800 or 1066 is all you need even with overclocking the FSB it hard to out run Double Data Rate 800 with a 1333 Cpu
Gigabyte GA EP45 UD3R or Asus P5Q E are both good boards and look at the E8500 for about $15 more.

When you pick the Ram get 2 1 gig sticks or 2 2gig sticks.

**wrench97** · 11-21-2008, 04:31 PM

I missed the mAtx does it have to be a mAtx?

daveyp · 11-21-2008, 04:48 PM

Yeah, it does really. I want to upgrade within the same case which is MATX.

So is there no link between FSB and memory speed?

**wrench97** · 11-21-2008, 04:52 PM

No the Intel memory controller is on the board not in the chip.
A mAtx case is going to give you heat problems what Brand and Model case is it?

daveyp · 11-21-2008, 04:57 PM

It's actually a compaq case, I originally had the Compaq PC bought for me from PC World in the UK and I upgraded it a while back with an 8800 GTS, some ram, a new PSU and a new hard drive and I'm now looking to upgrade the CPU too as it's getting a bit sluggish.

I've attached a picture of the case.

**wrench97** · 11-21-2008, 05:03 PM

Your going to need a case OEM's use proprietary front panel connectors which will make it hard to set up a standard matx board and wire the power and reset switches any front USB ports and Front Audio ports.

daveyp · 11-21-2008, 05:14 PM

How frustrating! I really like this case, looks nice, very sturdy, good size and has a built in card reader. Now i've got one extra thing to have to buy!

**wrench97** · 11-21-2008, 05:30 PM

It can be done, but I think for what you want there are too many hurdles with a 8800 card and a powerful chipset you need to get rid of the heat in the system, small cases tend to keep the heat contained and hurt performance as well as shorten component life.

If you can find the pin outs for your current connectors and the standard Atx/Matx connectors it's possible to solder the wires together if you can find out where they go oem's don't have the actual wiring diagrams on their web sites but you could try googleing pin outs for xxxx(your model number) and see what you get.

daveyp · 11-21-2008, 05:32 PM

Yeah you're right about there being too many hurdles :p

I think I will probably have to buy a new case, do you have any idea if the card reader will move across to the new case? It looks removable but I guess there may be issues with connecting to a non propriety mobo and its probably not a standard drive bay size either.

**wrench97** · 11-21-2008, 05:36 PM

It's possible depends if it uses a normal usb header connection or not.
The size is probably standard.

daveyp · 11-21-2008, 05:45 PM

Hmm i've removed the front panel and i think the size might not be standard, it looks like the card reader itself might be a floppy drive bay size but with a fascia making it as wide as a DVD drive but not as tall.

I can't really see the connectors though without turning everything off and having a fiddle so i'll have to check that out later.

**wrench97** · 11-21-2008, 05:47 PM

You can get one for about $20 so I would not be too concerned at the moment you could add it at any time.

daveyp · 11-21-2008, 05:55 PM

Yeah that's true, the thing is I'm happy with my current pc, it's just getting a bit slow and I want to upgrade it a bit, but now I'm basically going to have to build an entire new pc.

**wrench97** · 11-21-2008, 05:58 PM

Been there done that, maybe that's why there's more pc's then people in my house:)

daveyp · 11-21-2008, 06:36 PM

hahah sounds like a good house to me!

Do you know of any good cases? I want something quite smart and stylish rather than all these weird weird LED light littered gaming cases. I've passed that phase now :p I can't seem to find any though. Most cases either fall in to the LED littered gaming cases category or the looks old and boring category.

**wrench97** · 11-22-2008, 02:54 AM

I used a few of these lately decent case just enough room > http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...119106&bop=And

or this one > http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16811133048

Depending on what you want to spend the CoolerMaster Cosmos is nice case but over $100

daveyp · 11-23-2008, 05:59 PM

I've gone with a similar coolermaster case to your link.

This is what I was thinking of, what do you think? :

CPU - http://www.cclonline.com/product-info.asp?id=19760
Motherboard - http://www.cclonline.com/product-info.asp?id=27966
Ram - http://www.cclonline.com/product-info.asp?id=14845
Case - http://www.cclonline.com/product-info.asp?id=9660

**wrench97** · 11-24-2008, 01:42 AM

It will all work, the case is almost the same with a different face bezel.

daveyp · 11-24-2008, 10:30 AM

Is it good though? I've gone for 4gb of ram but i've been reading that XP 32-Bit won't be able to detect it all or something, will that cause me problems?

11-21-2008, 03:41 PM	#1 (permalink)
daveyp Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 30 OS: xp home	Upgrading my PC, question about FSB's and RAM. I'm thinking of upgrading my PC to an Intel Core 2 Duo E8400, as having looked at benchmarks on Tom's Hardware it seems like a very good all round CPU. With this I would also have to replace my motherboard and RAM, which I'm fine with, however because of the 1333 FSB it looks like I'm going to need DDR3 ram and a compatible motherboard. This is turning out more expensive than I was looking for (I was shooting for around £250). Another limiting factor is that I'm currently using a M-ATX form factor case and want to stick with it. I was wondering if it is possible to run this CPU at a lower FSB and therefore go for DDR2 ram and a compatible M-ATX motherboard to save money and if that is worth doing? Or should I just go for a CPU with a lower FSB? Current Setup: CPU AMD Athlon 64, 2000 MHz, 3200+ Motherboard MSI Amethyst-M Ram - 1792 MB (DDR SDRAM) Hynix - 256 MB PC3200 DDR SDRAM Samsung - 256 MB PC2700 DDR SDRAM Nanya - 256 MB PC2700 DDR SDRAM Kingston K 0 1 GB PC3200 DDR SDRAM Graphics Card NVIDIA GeForce 8800 GTS (640 MB) Monitor Samsung SyncMaster Hard Drive Western Digital SATA 300gb PSU OCZ GameXStream 600

11-21-2008, 04:29 PM	#2 (permalink)
wrench97 Moderator, Hardware Team Join Date: May 2008 Location: S.E. Pennsylvania Posts: 18,392 OS: Win7	Re: Upgrading my PC, question about FSB's and RAM. Motherboard yes you will need to change DDR3 you don't need or want Intel Memory buss and Cpu FSB are different from AMD Good P43 or P45 board and DDR2 800 or 1066 is all you need even with overclocking the FSB it hard to out run Double Data Rate 800 with a 1333 Cpu Gigabyte GA EP45 UD3R or Asus P5Q E are both good boards and look at the E8500 for about $15 more. When you pick the Ram get 2 1 gig sticks or 2 2gig sticks. __________________ Power Supply and Selection

11-21-2008, 04:31 PM	#3 (permalink)
wrench97 Moderator, Hardware Team Join Date: May 2008 Location: S.E. Pennsylvania Posts: 18,392 OS: Win7	Re: Upgrading my PC, question about FSB's and RAM. I missed the mAtx does it have to be a mAtx? __________________ Power Supply and Selection

11-21-2008, 04:48 PM	#4 (permalink)
daveyp Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 30 OS: xp home	Re: Upgrading my PC, question about FSB's and RAM. Yeah, it does really. I want to upgrade within the same case which is MATX. So is there no link between FSB and memory speed?

11-21-2008, 04:52 PM	#5 (permalink)
wrench97 Moderator, Hardware Team Join Date: May 2008 Location: S.E. Pennsylvania Posts: 18,392 OS: Win7	Re: Upgrading my PC, question about FSB's and RAM. No the Intel memory controller is on the board not in the chip. A mAtx case is going to give you heat problems what Brand and Model case is it? __________________ Power Supply and Selection

11-21-2008, 05:03 PM	#7 (permalink)
wrench97 Moderator, Hardware Team Join Date: May 2008 Location: S.E. Pennsylvania Posts: 18,392 OS: Win7	Re: Upgrading my PC, question about FSB's and RAM. Your going to need a case OEM's use proprietary front panel connectors which will make it hard to set up a standard matx board and wire the power and reset switches any front USB ports and Front Audio ports. __________________ Power Supply and Selection

11-21-2008, 05:14 PM	#8 (permalink)
daveyp Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 30 OS: xp home	Re: Upgrading my PC, question about FSB's and RAM. How frustrating! I really like this case, looks nice, very sturdy, good size and has a built in card reader. Now i've got one extra thing to have to buy!

11-21-2008, 05:30 PM	#9 (permalink)
wrench97 Moderator, Hardware Team Join Date: May 2008 Location: S.E. Pennsylvania Posts: 18,392 OS: Win7	Re: Upgrading my PC, question about FSB's and RAM. It can be done, but I think for what you want there are too many hurdles with a 8800 card and a powerful chipset you need to get rid of the heat in the system, small cases tend to keep the heat contained and hurt performance as well as shorten component life. If you can find the pin outs for your current connectors and the standard Atx/Matx connectors it's possible to solder the wires together if you can find out where they go oem's don't have the actual wiring diagrams on their web sites but you could try googleing pin outs for xxxx(your model number) and see what you get. __________________ Power Supply and Selection

11-21-2008, 05:32 PM	#10 (permalink)
daveyp Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 30 OS: xp home	Re: Upgrading my PC, question about FSB's and RAM. Yeah you're right about there being too many hurdles :p I think I will probably have to buy a new case, do you have any idea if the card reader will move across to the new case? It looks removable but I guess there may be issues with connecting to a non propriety mobo and its probably not a standard drive bay size either.

11-21-2008, 05:36 PM	#11 (permalink)
wrench97 Moderator, Hardware Team Join Date: May 2008 Location: S.E. Pennsylvania Posts: 18,392 OS: Win7	Re: Upgrading my PC, question about FSB's and RAM. It's possible depends if it uses a normal usb header connection or not. The size is probably standard. __________________ Power Supply and Selection

11-21-2008, 05:45 PM	#12 (permalink)
daveyp Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 30 OS: xp home	Re: Upgrading my PC, question about FSB's and RAM. Hmm i've removed the front panel and i think the size might not be standard, it looks like the card reader itself might be a floppy drive bay size but with a fascia making it as wide as a DVD drive but not as tall. I can't really see the connectors though without turning everything off and having a fiddle so i'll have to check that out later.

11-21-2008, 05:47 PM	#13 (permalink)
wrench97 Moderator, Hardware Team Join Date: May 2008 Location: S.E. Pennsylvania Posts: 18,392 OS: Win7	Re: Upgrading my PC, question about FSB's and RAM. You can get one for about $20 so I would not be too concerned at the moment you could add it at any time. __________________ Power Supply and Selection

11-21-2008, 05:55 PM	#14 (permalink)
daveyp Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 30 OS: xp home	Re: Upgrading my PC, question about FSB's and RAM. Yeah that's true, the thing is I'm happy with my current pc, it's just getting a bit slow and I want to upgrade it a bit, but now I'm basically going to have to build an entire new pc.

11-21-2008, 05:58 PM	#15 (permalink)
wrench97 Moderator, Hardware Team Join Date: May 2008 Location: S.E. Pennsylvania Posts: 18,392 OS: Win7	Re: Upgrading my PC, question about FSB's and RAM. Been there done that, maybe that's why there's more pc's then people in my house:) __________________ Power Supply and Selection

11-21-2008, 06:36 PM	#16 (permalink)
daveyp Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 30 OS: xp home	Re: Upgrading my PC, question about FSB's and RAM. hahah sounds like a good house to me! Do you know of any good cases? I want something quite smart and stylish rather than all these weird weird LED light littered gaming cases. I've passed that phase now :p I can't seem to find any though. Most cases either fall in to the LED littered gaming cases category or the looks old and boring category.

11-22-2008, 02:54 AM	#17 (permalink)
wrench97 Moderator, Hardware Team Join Date: May 2008 Location: S.E. Pennsylvania Posts: 18,392 OS: Win7	Re: Upgrading my PC, question about FSB's and RAM. I used a few of these lately decent case just enough room > http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...119106&bop=And or this one > http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16811133048 Depending on what you want to spend the CoolerMaster Cosmos is nice case but over $100 __________________ Power Supply and Selection

11-23-2008, 05:59 PM	#18 (permalink)
daveyp Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 30 OS: xp home	Re: Upgrading my PC, question about FSB's and RAM. I've gone with a similar coolermaster case to your link. This is what I was thinking of, what do you think? : CPU - http://www.cclonline.com/product-info.asp?id=19760 Motherboard - http://www.cclonline.com/product-info.asp?id=27966 Ram - http://www.cclonline.com/product-info.asp?id=14845 Case - http://www.cclonline.com/product-info.asp?id=9660

11-24-2008, 01:42 AM	#19 (permalink)
wrench97 Moderator, Hardware Team Join Date: May 2008 Location: S.E. Pennsylvania Posts: 18,392 OS: Win7	Re: Upgrading my PC, question about FSB's and RAM. It will all work, the case is almost the same with a different face bezel. __________________ Power Supply and Selection

11-24-2008, 10:30 AM	#20 (permalink)
daveyp Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 30 OS: xp home	Re: Upgrading my PC, question about FSB's and RAM. Is it good though? I've gone for 4gb of ram but i've been reading that XP 32-Bit won't be able to detect it all or something, will that cause me problems?