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Possible Faulty Power Supply

4K views 17 replies 8 participants last post by  Masterchiefxx17 
#1 ·
Hi,

Computer has been running perfectly fine since I built it (4 years). A week ago shut off randomly, booted up again no problems. Yesterday, randomly shut off and it came back on with a message that stated "power supply surges detected during the previous power on. Asus anti-surge was triggered to protect system from unstable power supply." Computer then rebooted, and worked fine the rest of the night. Put computer to sleep and woke up this morning and whenever I tried to turn it on the computer would turn on for a bit and then shut off. Sometimes I can get the computer to stay on for a a few minutes, but there is no signal to the monitors. 3 red lights visible, (Boot, VGA Led, and CPU led).

Turned off computer, few hours later tried turning it on and computer wouldn't come on. Tried reseating RAM and now I turn on computer and it will come on, shut off, and then come back on a few seconds later with just 1 red light "DRAM." Still no signals to monitor. Tried reseating video card as well, have unplugged everything from the back except for one monitor cable. Not sure what the problem is.. my gut says faulty power supply. I still have 1 year left on RMA. Any help appreciated!


Specs:

Specs:
ASUS P8P67 PRO (REV 3.1) LGA 1155 Intel P67 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX Intel Motherboard

MSI N560GTX-TI Twin Frozr II/OC GeForce GTX 560 Ti (Fermi) 1GB 256-Bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready SLI Support Video Card

Intel Core i7-2600K Sandy Bridge Quad-Core 3.4GHz (3.8GHz Turbo Boost) LGA 1155 95W Desktop Processor Intel HD Graphics 3000 BX80623I72600K

G.SKILL Ripjaws Series 16GB (4 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model F3-12800CL9Q-16GBRL

Corsair TX850W Power Supply

Thanks,
Ryan
 
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#2 ·
Tried reseating RAM
Why??? Your system is telling you you got a power issue.

Reseating RAM rarely does anything but destroy the RAM due to mishandling (ESD, failure to unplug power from the wall, excessive physical force, attempting to insert backwards :cry:) during the reseating process. RAM slots, for years, have been designed to lock RAM properly in place so (1) it cannot come loose and (2) seal dirt out.

Tried reseating video card as well
Again, why??? You didn't get a graphics error!

my gut says faulty power supply
Your gut? Why don't you believe the ASUS error message? :confused:

I am not trying to give you a hard time, but everything (symptoms AND error messages) is saying power and you are looking at everything else. :confused:

The very first thing I always look at when there are sudden unexplained freezes, sudden reboots, or sudden shutdowns is heat. So I inspect the interior to ensure it is clean of heat trapping dust and all fans spin freely. If nice and clean and fan bearings are not seized, then the next thing I do is swap in a known good PSU to ensure I am providing good, clean stable power.

So that's what you need to do first. Nothing else will work properly if you are not providing stable power. If you don't have a spare supply (or trusting friend that will let you swap in his/hers) then you need to have your supply professionally tested by a qualified technician.

You can use a PSU Tester or a program like Speccy (from the makers of CCleaner) to check your voltages, but neither of these are conclusive (neither is a multimeter) because they don't test for ripple and other anomalies that affect computer stability, nor do they put realistic or a variety of proper loads on the PSU. And with intermittent problems, you have to be lucky to catch the fault while looking.

So it needs to be professionally tested by a tech with a power supply analyzer and/or a good o'scope (or swap in a known good spare supply - a tried and trued troubleshooting method used by technicians since the beginning of time).

In the meantime, I would stop using this computer with that PSU or you risk damaging your motherboard and everything connected to it (if not already damaged :frown:). While collateral damage to connected devices is rare, that is the responsibility of a properly working power supply. So it is not, by any means, out of the realm of possibilities.

NO DOUBT, Corsair is a quality brand, known for quality PSUs, and one of my preferred brands. But until Man can create perfection 100% of the time, there will always be premature failures.
 
#3 ·
Hey Bill!

Thanks for the reply. My goal was reseating the RAM and video card (definitely seems stupid in hindsight) was to go for a bare minimum start up. I saw on a few tech forums that before completely diagnosing it is a PSU problem that one can test each stick of RAM at once and also reseat the card just in case. Guess I was hoping for one of those to be the problem for an easy fix. Will look into the computer for dust and get the PSU to a technician to check. Thanks again, no worries on the hard time hah! Will be back with update at some point.
 
#8 ·
Will look into the computer for dust and get the PSU to a technician to check.
Dust rarely causes problems since, if properly constructed. even a mostly obstructed heatsink still provides more than enough cooling in a 70 degree F room. Furthermore dust is irrelevant to your error messages. How many others (in other forums) wildly speculated to blame almore anything. You now have a problem. You mist somehow unlearn everything they said so as to not be confused.

Bill is spot on correct. Something in the power system (PSU is only one part of that system) apparently has a defect. One important point was overlooked. You have assumed if something works, then it must be OK. Well your power supply could have been defective even many months ago. Normal is for a power supply to be defective and yet still work barely enough so that the computer boots and runs.

Numbers from a meter (and not disconnecting anything) would take about one minute to read. Post those numbers. The fewer who actually know how hardware works can say, without any more doubts or speculation, whether the supply (or other system parts) is good or bad.

A defective system part could work just fine even with another supply. Or might start acting more defective. Again, a defective part may still boot a computer. But those numbers can identify defective parts without doubt. A definitive answer means providing numbers so that the fewer who know hardware are empowered to provide help.

One final point. Asus software is reading a meter on its motherboard. But that meter is not always accurate. Just another reason why a digital meter is so useful - to calibrate the motherboard's volt meter. Software is not touchy. But many do not know how electronics work. Then assume using what others have only speculated.

Without numbers from a digital meter, then the few who really know hardware can only remain silent.
 
#4 ·
Hi Reeon,

It's highly likely that the culprit is your current power supply. Do you have another power supply to test on your computer? I recommend testing a spare, power supply that fully compatible with your computer. Assuming you do all the testing and the current power supply is the issue and needs to be replaced, I recommend buying Seasonic, XFX, and Antec-HCG power supplies.

Hope everything works out well for you and feel free to ask more questions, thank you.
 
#5 ·
I saw on a few tech forums that before completely diagnosing it is a PSU problem that one can test each stick of RAM at once and also reseat the card just in case.
That's actually backwards logic. I understand it because most users don't have known good PSUs laying around to swap in. But you don't start tearing down a car engine that won't start before making sure there's enough clean gas in the tank coming out of the fuel pump. In troubleshooting hardware problems, you start at the wall. Is it plugged in? Is it turned on? Are you supplying good power?

Part of the problem is flakey (slightly out of tolerance) or "dirty" power (too much ripple) for examples, can manifest into symptoms that "appear" to be totally unrelated to bad power. PC PSUs output 12VDC, 5VDC, and 3.3VDC voltages. Fans can spin, LEDs can light (making the PSU "appear" to be working correctly) but if, for example the required +5VDC is outside the allowed ± 5% tolerance range of 4.75VDC to 5.25VDC, other devices in the computer may not work properly.

was to go for a bare minimum start up.
If you were experiencing memory problems, removing all but one stick would be your minimum startup scenario. Or if driver problems, booting into Safe Mode would be a minimum startup scenario.

Where I was getting confused is you were getting an error specifically stating power supply problems.

For sure, don't feel stupid - even in hindsight. It is all a learning experience and IMO, you were smart to start asking questions. :thumb:
 
#7 ·
I am afraid you have misinterpreted the results. Disabling the software is like covering up the "Engine Hot" warning light in your car because it's annoying instead of determining what's wrong and fixing it. The ASUS Anti-surge Protection works and it works quite well and its warnings need to be heeded, not ignored.

If it is triggered, that means (1), the PSU encountered an excessive power anomaly from the wall such as a surge or spike - or sag (opposite of surge) or dip (opposite of spike) - it could not properly compensate for (note that unstable line voltage is the primary reason for this feature). Or (2), it means your PSU is incapable of dealing with the rapid changes in power demands (changing loads) fast enough to maintain the output voltages within ATX tolerance specifications.

In other words, the software is telling you you need a better quality PSU, or a more powerful PSU, or a better and more powerful PSU. And (or) you need better regulation on your mains - and I recommend all computers be on a "good" UPS with AVR for that.

Note you can certainly find many users complaining that the ASUS Anti-surge Protector shut down their computers. But they are just blaming the messenger - the software that blocked damaging voltage anomalies from damaging their hardware - instead of listening to the messenger's message.

If ASUS Anti-surge Protection was too sensitive, the professional motherboard review sites would be bashing it and recommend users disable it. But that is not happening - at least I have never seen any review recommend disabling it. If you can find a professional motherboard reviewer making such a claim and recommendation, please post a link.

Turn off or remove the software and check voltages in the BIOS for 12, 5 and 3.3V
Better to swap in a known good supply. Running the BIOS Setup Menu is about the least demanding task we can ask of our computers, putting the lowest possible load on the PSUs, besides turning it off. The CPU is at idle and the GPU is displaying a static (not animated) display in basic 256-color, low resolution VGA mode - as no drivers have yet to be loaded.

Plus, typical damaging power anomalies are too quick to see! If you don't have a tester as I mentioned above, you can see if the PSU outputs are within the required ± 5% tolerance ranges with minimal load - but that hardly conclusive. You might be able to see a "long-duration" surge or sag, but you will never see any spike or dip in the BIOS, or with one of those testers (or a multimeter either). That can only be done with professional (read: expensive) power supply analyzing test equipment. So again, for normal users, that means swapping in a known good PSU, and ensuring the power to the PSU is clean and stable. An AC Outlet Tester can at least make sure the outlet is wired and grounded properly.
 
#10 ·
Hey guys!

Back again. I just finished installing the new power supply. Upon turning it on I am running into the same problem sadly. Check the video link to observe the issue, may help more than me just explaining it. Basically, computer comes on, DRAM red light on motherboard on, computer shuts off, then comes back on and recycles through the previous steps.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BzCiYgYCFFVCcHhFcW54OXVYbWM/view?usp=sharing


There was one point today where I was able to get one stick of RAM to work in the first slot closest to the processor. None of the other ones would work in that slot (DRAM red light for the other 3). I was able to log onto windows with the one stick but the desktop wasn't loading, all I could see was my cursor. Waited about 10 minutes to no avail, shut off my computer and tried again and could no longer get any sticks of RAM to work. Any suggestions? Of course the obvious answer is to RMA the RAM but I do not want to do that until I utilize all other resources.

Thanks for the help everyone.

PS Computer specs can be seen on my first post of the this forum.
 
#11 ·
Any suggestions?
Without instructions for numbers from a digital meter, then the fewer who really know (and even designed) hardware remain silent.

Again, only two choices exist. 1) Keep replacing good parts until something works (shotgunning). Or 2) empower assistance the fewer by providing relevant numbers from a meter. Without those numbers, then only speculation exists. Power supply was replaced only on speculation; not on evidence.

What determines power cycling? The power controller. Why does a power controller do that? Only meter numbers can say. A best solution has been repeatedly recommended.
 
#12 ·
Hey Westom!

Thanks for the reply. I guess I am a little confused at this point, because the brand new power supply not working (should) show that it there is another problem with my computer not originating from the power supply. Does a multimeter shed light onto problems of a computer besides that of the power supply? Any recommendations of a multimeter to buy?
 
#13 · (Edited)
Does a multimeter shed light onto problems of a computer besides that of the power supply?
Of course. That was stated repeatedly.

What is a power controller? Another part of the power 'system'. PSU is but one 'system' component. Are you assuming a PSU is the entire power 'system'?

Identify a defect before replacing any part. Otherwise continue replacing parts on speculation. Those are the two choices.

Buy a digital meter from Walmart, hardware store, Harbor Frieght, most Kmarts, etc. Many sell these for $5 (Harbor Frieght) or $13 (Walmart). Radio Shack may sell theirs at discount. Or from Amazon, Ebay, or borrow one from another. Even car mechanics have one.
 
#15 ·
Well, I am back but not with the original reply I thought I would be giving!

I feel quite stupid about this one, but my RAM was actually not seated properly. Basically, I just thought it through and I remembered that my computer with my old PSA (which was quite loud at this point) had no red DRAM light problems and would still shut off randomly..DRAM signal only started showing up when I first tried booting with one stick of RAM from the get go weeks ago. I went through my motherboard manual today and saw I was attempting booting in the A1 slot not the A2 slot like it recommended. I also didn't realize how hard you needed to push the RAM down to get it to click in by itself. Guess I wasn't applying enough pressure from the beginning. Got it to boot with 1 stick in A2 today and then ended up finding the right spots for the rest of them! Upon booting I was able to log in to my user but windows was "hung" and sitting on a black screen with my cursor able to move. Safe Mode worked fine upon restarting (could cntrl+alt+delete to get there). After much trial and error with this problem (so close but yet so far) I simply deleted my anti virus (out of date) and viola! Could see my desktop now and everything is working great!

New power supply is much more quiet than the old one, seems everything is A-okay now! Thanks for the replies all. I am fairly confident in my comp's stability now but definitely going to feel it out for a week before I believe this is fully solved.

Best,
Reeon
 
#16 ·
Make sure to install some antivirus program and a second-opinion antimalware scanner. Personally I use and recommend Avast Free Antivirus and Malwarebytes antimalware. Some might recommend Microsoft's Security Essentials (also free) and Window's inbuilt Defender. Defender was most likely disabled when you installed your former antivirus program and may require re-enabling if you choose to use it. If you can afford non-free ones, Bitdefender or Kaspersky are the best (based on lab tests), and if you decide to stick to the former antivirus that you just uninstalled, make sure to download and install the latest version available.
 
#17 · (Edited)
I agree you need to replace the old Antivirus but disagree that Bit Defender and Kaspersky are the best, that is only an opinion and should be stated that way.
Most Antivirus programs are somewhat useless today as the today's threats are everything but virus and rather fall into the overall Malware category. Kaspersky has been fraught with issues over the years and Bit Defender frequently also has compatibility issues.

I would suggest, and its my opinion Nod32 Antivirus which is good for all types of Malware or Emsisoft which is both Antivirus and AntiMalware and they are both paid. I have my own personal doubts about the ability of Microsoft Security Essentials. Windows Defender BTW only shuts itself off when another AV is present in Windows 8 and 8.1, not in every version of Windows as suggested. I also noticed Avast sales reps leaving Avast in droves lately and that can't bode well for them. Avira free used to be good but they got so wrapped up in trying to load in toolbars that their own product today is worse than most Malware and drags a system to a crawl as does AVG IMHO.
'
Great job solving your issue, don't beat on yourself not everyone is born knowing how to place ram sticks in a slot! This whole thing is users helping users.
 
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