Bush signed the Fence Bill

bry623 · 10-27-2006, 07:48 AM

We are going to build a 700 foot fence along our southern border. This really hacks me off because I think it should be electrifed.

**Fr4665** · 10-27-2006, 07:51 AM

haha agreed on the electric fence but can we get a 5 foot thick concrete wall too with barbed wire ? atleast were slowly moving closer to the goal of keeping ILLEGAL immigrants out.

why did i cap illegal cause everyones like OMG you dont want immigrants thats not true i dont want illegal ones that i have to pay for healthcare and taxes for their illegal kids going to school.

**40sondacurb** · 10-27-2006, 10:20 AM

The only thing that fence will do is raise the price of ladders in Mexico.

**bruiser** · 10-27-2006, 10:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 40sondacurb

The only thing that fence will do is raise the price of ladders in Mexico.

Well, their economy needs the boost that higher priced ladders will cause.

bry623 · 10-27-2006, 10:24 AM

LOL 40s!

**Wozer** · 10-27-2006, 11:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bry623

We are going to build a 700 foot fence along our southern border. This really hacks me off because I think it should be electrifed.

and equipped with towers containing 50 caliber machine guns @ 400yd intervals...

its just political pandering, as no funding is supplied...bleh...I say build a wall that would make the one that used to exist in East Germany look feeble...

along with many others, I am sick and tired of having my tax dollars fund services for illegal immigrants...and having my pay undercut by those that don't have to pay taxes like I do...and what ultimately sickens me is the rhetoric used by the Mexican government re: its the right of the illegals to obtain such services...***edited for use of words not appropriate of a family oriented forum***

yustr · 10-27-2006, 12:01 PM

Just imagine what the price of tomatoes will need to be when they have to pay real wages to pick the crops. Cha-cing Cha-cing….

Oh wait, that's what farm subsidies are for....

Pay me now or pay me later....Cha-cing Cha-cing

~~jeffdrummer~~ · 10-27-2006, 12:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yustr

Just imagine what the price of tomatoes will need to be when they have to pay real wages to pick the crops. Cha-cing Cha-cing….

Oh wait, that's what farm subsidies are for....

Pay me now or pay me later....Cha-cing Cha-cing

What did we do before we had illegals do all the jobs we supposedly won't do?

Quote:

its just political pandering, as no funding is supplied...bleh...

I found the fact that there is no funding odd too. But the fence has to be built by Dec. 31 2008. We are going to need cheap labor for this one...

Are there really going to be automatic weapons there? If there are I would say it is good.

"Speak softly and wield a big stick."

**Wozer** · 10-27-2006, 12:12 PM

AFAIK the migrant farm workers are here under their own 'plan' that is approved by the government..then again, I may be wrong....

**Wozer** · 10-27-2006, 12:25 PM

after doing a google on the issue, I find very little current information about this subject..there is an indication that laws are in the works about all of this, which leads me to believe that such laws are not currently in effect...

http://www.pdhre.org/rights/migrants.html

I have no issue with all of the rights mentioned there...

and actually, I have no issues with migrant workers...

what I do have issues with are those workers who because of the ability to work for less simply because of not paying taxes (consider that in my trade, many jobs are still 'contract' labor, hence self employed with no taxes deducted..and yeah, I am one of those)...guarantee that they are put on a level playing field with me, then I have no objections...but because of simple economics (low bidders usually get the work...and they can bid ~30% less and still live the same lifestyle) they do what they do...which is take jobs from those that have to pay taxes because of citizenship...the fact that most of them are hispanic is of no issue to me (my wife is hispanic)...the issue as noted, is paying of taxes...

now..for those in positions where they have faked their status, and are having taxes deducted...well any reasonable person's status of that subject is obvious...if anything, the illegal immigrant is being cheated and deserves what is his/hers....

level the field!

yustr · 10-27-2006, 12:40 PM

I want to see how much of that 700 miles will be build with illegal labor...if construction crews down that way are anything like they are here (or just about anywhere else in the US I've been) the chance of finding an American to do that work is slim. Oh wait, it will be a Government job - so price is no object. Just wait until you see the cost per mile. It will rival building a freeway.

Then again, all those KBR crews will be coming home from Iraq about that time so they can just move down there....

~~jeffdrummer~~ · 10-27-2006, 08:10 PM

I heard about 3 million dollars per mile.

No price is too high to save our country.

**Chode** · 10-28-2006, 04:15 PM

Doggone right JeffD! No price is too high to save our country! But what makes you think a fence is going to save us? Anyway, what is it going to save us from?

The Administration is already diverting funds from the fence, and previous experience in Los Angeles and elsewhere suggests a fence isn't going to be as effective as many think. And "save our country"? Oh, please. Yes, we need to be protected from hard-working people who are devoted to their families, and are conservative Christians.

There seems to be a popular misconception that Mexicans come to the U.S. to go on welfare and suck us dry like vampires. Nothing could be further from the truth. I lived in Austin, TX for 24 years where I worked alongside many Hispanics. In some cases, I found out after 10 years or so that I had an illegal co-worker.

But, you know what? During that time they filled a job that would have paid no more for a U.S. citizen (this was a Union scale job), they paid taxes just like the rest of us, and didn't use any social services that anyone in the same economic group wouldn't have been eligible for if they had been born a citizen. These were often positions that we couldn't fill with "real" Americans because they preferred to sit it out on welfare.

These illegals worked as hard as any people I've ever known because they appreciated what a job meant. They learned English and tried to fit in with our society as best they might. How does that make them any different from your ancestors or mine?

yustr · 10-28-2006, 05:32 PM

Sorry to Hitler the thread but hatred of imigrants is exactly what the Nazis did in the 1930's - only instead of "illegals" it was the Jews and the Gypsies. More recently it has been directed at the Turks. Once hate starts to flow it rapidly infects the rest of society. Maybe that's what Bush and his New American Century fascists are trying to do. Create hate for one group, then spread that hate to others. Then they'll come swooping in to save us from the invading mongrels - just have to give up your liberty - we swear its only for a little while.

Divide and conquer.

**Fr4665** · 10-30-2006, 12:11 AM

daaaamn 3 million dollars for a mile ! holy fence ! ill build one for that myself with machine guns included.

i think the whole hatred dealio is growing out of proportion cause immigrants that are here legal feel attacked but they are not. maybe they should learn to speak english and then they can understand what we are saying. i mean we need immigrant workers but we cant support a tumor of illegals that we support with our taxes and those taxes could be spent better.

the highschool i went too was atleast 50 % south american and id say around 35% of the south americans were illegal. what do i base this on ? the fact that i had inside sources from south americans telling me this and i knew 3 out of 5 south americans that we used to sit at lunch were illegal.

~~jeffdrummer~~ · 10-30-2006, 06:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yustr

Sorry to Hitler the thread but hatred of imigrants is exactly what the Nazis did in the 1930's - only instead of "illegals" it was the Jews and the Gypsies. More recently it has been directed at the Turks. Once hate starts to flow it rapidly infects the rest of society. Maybe that's what Bush and his New American Century fascists are trying to do. Create hate for one group, then spread that hate to others. Then they'll come swooping in to save us from the invading mongrels - just have to give up your liberty - we swear its only for a little while.

Divide and conquer.

I'm by no means xenophobic. I just like the idea of the government being able to curb the number of people coming into the country, and which. 1 month after Hitler came into office (Feb. 1933) there were over 400 anti-Jew laws. I am struggling to find a parallel between not allowing illegals in and taking businesses, rights, and lives away from a race. We want to protect our country from the massive influx of illegals, our goals are not genocidal, or even taking Constitutional rights away... Are you not able to understand why we would like to control who comes into our country?

**Fox** · 10-30-2006, 07:01 AM

Quote:

More recently it has been directed at the Turks.

Very true. While in Germany, I got to know only a few Turks- the rest were (by choice) in their own communities and kept to themselves. They were sort of looked at as an annoyance.

10-27-2006, 07:48 AM	#1 (permalink)
bry623 Manager, The Conversation Pit/Analyst, Security Team Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: NW Territory circa 1787 Posts: 10,452 OS: winxp pro sp2	Bush signed the Fence Bill We are going to build a 700 foot fence along our southern border. This really hacks me off because I think it should be electrifed. __________________ Scarlet and Gray in L.A. 9/13/08

10-27-2006, 07:51 AM	#2 (permalink)
Fr4665 aka mr.fraggs Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: USA or Germany Posts: 2,959 OS: Win XP,Knoppix My System	haha agreed on the electric fence but can we get a 5 foot thick concrete wall too with barbed wire ? atleast were slowly moving closer to the goal of keeping ILLEGAL immigrants out. why did i cap illegal cause everyones like OMG you dont want immigrants thats not true i dont want illegal ones that i have to pay for healthcare and taxes for their illegal kids going to school. __________________ I don't subscribe to threads please PM me if i miss a reply. ------- Everest SensorView Pro DriverCleaner how to fix your game

10-27-2006, 10:20 AM	#3 (permalink)
40sondacurb #64 & #36 BACKBONE Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 5,701 OS: xp	The only thing that fence will do is raise the price of ladders in Mexico. __________________ Donate to keep the forum running "I know the human being and fish can coexist peacefully" -George W. Bush

10-27-2006, 10:24 AM	#5 (permalink)
bry623 Manager, The Conversation Pit/Analyst, Security Team Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: NW Territory circa 1787 Posts: 10,452 OS: winxp pro sp2	LOL 40s! __________________ Scarlet and Gray in L.A. 9/13/08

10-27-2006, 12:01 PM	#7 (permalink)
yustr Asst. Manager, The Conversation Pit Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Connecticut shore/California Desert Posts: 4,673 OS: PCLinuxOS, XP Pro My System	Just imagine what the price of tomatoes will need to be when they have to pay real wages to pick the crops. Cha-cing Cha-cing…. Oh wait, that's what farm subsidies are for.... Pay me now or pay me later....Cha-cing Cha-cing __________________ I didn't mean to say it. But I meant what I said. J. McMurtry

10-27-2006, 12:12 PM	#9 (permalink)
Wozer TSF Enthusiast Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 1,002 OS: 2kpro/XP pro/MCE	AFAIK the migrant farm workers are here under their own 'plan' that is approved by the government..then again, I may be wrong.... __________________ Beware of the big 3 insurance companies in Texas! Read your policies carefully (maybe you'll need a lawyer) and enjoy the 6% increase in your rates you are about to receive from Allstate, Farmers & State Farm for most likely reduced coverage

10-27-2006, 12:25 PM	#10 (permalink)
Wozer TSF Enthusiast Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 1,002 OS: 2kpro/XP pro/MCE	after doing a google on the issue, I find very little current information about this subject..there is an indication that laws are in the works about all of this, which leads me to believe that such laws are not currently in effect... http://www.pdhre.org/rights/migrants.html I have no issue with all of the rights mentioned there... and actually, I have no issues with migrant workers... what I do have issues with are those workers who because of the ability to work for less simply because of not paying taxes (consider that in my trade, many jobs are still 'contract' labor, hence self employed with no taxes deducted..and yeah, I am one of those)...guarantee that they are put on a level playing field with me, then I have no objections...but because of simple economics (low bidders usually get the work...and they can bid ~30% less and still live the same lifestyle) they do what they do...which is take jobs from those that have to pay taxes because of citizenship...the fact that most of them are hispanic is of no issue to me (my wife is hispanic)...the issue as noted, is paying of taxes... now..for those in positions where they have faked their status, and are having taxes deducted...well any reasonable person's status of that subject is obvious...if anything, the illegal immigrant is being cheated and deserves what is his/hers.... level the field! __________________ Beware of the big 3 insurance companies in Texas! Read your policies carefully (maybe you'll need a lawyer) and enjoy the 6% increase in your rates you are about to receive from Allstate, Farmers & State Farm for most likely reduced coverage

10-27-2006, 12:40 PM	#11 (permalink)
yustr Asst. Manager, The Conversation Pit Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Connecticut shore/California Desert Posts: 4,673 OS: PCLinuxOS, XP Pro My System	I want to see how much of that 700 miles will be build with illegal labor...if construction crews down that way are anything like they are here (or just about anywhere else in the US I've been) the chance of finding an American to do that work is slim. Oh wait, it will be a Government job - so price is no object. Just wait until you see the cost per mile. It will rival building a freeway. Then again, all those KBR crews will be coming home from Iraq about that time so they can just move down there.... __________________ I didn't mean to say it. But I meant what I said. J. McMurtry

10-27-2006, 08:10 PM	#12 (permalink)
~~jeffdrummer~~ Register user Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Buffalo, NY Posts: 870 OS: MAC OS X 10.4.8, and 10.5!! WinXP SP2	I heard about 3 million dollars per mile. No price is too high to save our country.

10-28-2006, 04:15 PM	#13 (permalink)
Chode TSF Enthusiast Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 726 OS: Windows XP Pro	Doggone right JeffD! No price is too high to save our country! But what makes you think a fence is going to save us? Anyway, what is it going to save us from? The Administration is already diverting funds from the fence, and previous experience in Los Angeles and elsewhere suggests a fence isn't going to be as effective as many think. And "save our country"? Oh, please. Yes, we need to be protected from hard-working people who are devoted to their families, and are conservative Christians. There seems to be a popular misconception that Mexicans come to the U.S. to go on welfare and suck us dry like vampires. Nothing could be further from the truth. I lived in Austin, TX for 24 years where I worked alongside many Hispanics. In some cases, I found out after 10 years or so that I had an illegal co-worker. But, you know what? During that time they filled a job that would have paid no more for a U.S. citizen (this was a Union scale job), they paid taxes just like the rest of us, and didn't use any social services that anyone in the same economic group wouldn't have been eligible for if they had been born a citizen. These were often positions that we couldn't fill with "real" Americans because they preferred to sit it out on welfare. These illegals worked as hard as any people I've ever known because they appreciated what a job meant. They learned English and tried to fit in with our society as best they might. How does that make them any different from your ancestors or mine? __________________ Sweet!

10-28-2006, 05:32 PM	#14 (permalink)
yustr Asst. Manager, The Conversation Pit Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Connecticut shore/California Desert Posts: 4,673 OS: PCLinuxOS, XP Pro My System	Sorry to Hitler the thread but hatred of imigrants is exactly what the Nazis did in the 1930's - only instead of "illegals" it was the Jews and the Gypsies. More recently it has been directed at the Turks. Once hate starts to flow it rapidly infects the rest of society. Maybe that's what Bush and his New American Century fascists are trying to do. Create hate for one group, then spread that hate to others. Then they'll come swooping in to save us from the invading mongrels - just have to give up your liberty - we swear its only for a little while. Divide and conquer. __________________ I didn't mean to say it. But I meant what I said. J. McMurtry

10-30-2006, 12:11 AM	#15 (permalink)
Fr4665 aka mr.fraggs Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: USA or Germany Posts: 2,959 OS: Win XP,Knoppix My System	daaaamn 3 million dollars for a mile ! holy fence ! ill build one for that myself with machine guns included. i think the whole hatred dealio is growing out of proportion cause immigrants that are here legal feel attacked but they are not. maybe they should learn to speak english and then they can understand what we are saying. i mean we need immigrant workers but we cant support a tumor of illegals that we support with our taxes and those taxes could be spent better. the highschool i went too was atleast 50 % south american and id say around 35% of the south americans were illegal. what do i base this on ? the fact that i had inside sources from south americans telling me this and i knew 3 out of 5 south americans that we used to sit at lunch were illegal. __________________ I don't subscribe to threads please PM me if i miss a reply. ------- Everest SensorView Pro DriverCleaner how to fix your game