grogg1256

i have a 99 malibu and this weekend, while driving, it died. my husband looked it over, and thought it was the ignition control module, because he checked it with his meter and could read power going in, but none was coming out. he replaced it, but with no luck. there have not been any dummy lights recently, a few months ago, the check engine light came on, but it went off the next time i started it.
the engine will crank, but will not engage. there arent any strange noises, and all the accesories work.
im not very engine savvy, but i try--and i will relay info to my husband who is quite frustrated with the computers in new cars and would much rather return to the way they used to be!

BUDFAN8

first thing to do is find out what is missing. the car needs fuel, spark, and air to run.

if he can do a few tests to find out witch one its lacking it would help to figure out what is going on.

first test pull a plug wire off put a spark plug in it lay it on the block or any good metal part and turn the ignition over look for spark.

second you will need a fuel pressure gauge to see how much pressure you have at the fuel rail

third make sure your air filter is in good enough condition to let air through it.

after you find out witch your car is lacking we will try to send you in the right direction.


Bud.

grogg1256

he let someone borrow his fuel pressure gauge..so you know how that goes--but he thinks the fuel seems fine. hes lacking spark, and he started tracking it from the battery, and the juice ran out at the ignition control module. which is before the spark plugs, so there definitely is no spark. he isnt here at the moment, so im going from memory, youll have to excuse me!!
but since im the one that drives the car...
1. on occasion, it would idle rough at redlights
2. i have had the abs, brake, check engine and coolant lights come on, but they were always gone at next start up
3. the sun roof doesnt always close
4. i have had to tap the gas to get it to start on occasion
5. he just happened to be driving when it died, and it made a lot of racket and backfired when he tried to restart it, and that was the end of it.
i really appreciate your help!!!

Whitetail Crazy

Is the security light flashing? I had a grand am recently that would crank and not start, let sit for 10 minutes with key on and it would start.
I also posted an FYI on a odd finding. Unplug mass air flow sensor to see if it will start.

grogg1256

nothing done today seemed to solve the problem, but its definitely lacking spark. he replaced the crank postioning sensor, but still nothing. he then traced and probed all the wires in the entire car with his ohm meter--and no problems. from reading various things, he then went on to the ignition switch. he took it out and tested it according to the haynes book, and was only getting about half of the steps? to show currency. the other ones would read around 6--i forgot to ask if it was ohm or volts or??. he is looking for any other way to test it because this part is another 90 and he wants to make sure this is the problem.

i will have him look into the mass airflow sensor. i had a 89 grandam a long time ago, i dont remember what was wrong, but he unplugged something around the transmission because it would die after it got hot and then i had to listen and when it was time to shift i had to lay off the gas so it could shift.

i really apprecaite all this, its a good car and worth fixing.

Whitetail Crazy

Be sure to pay attention to the security light- could just need to relearn the key resistance.. I have had them both ways- wouldn't crank and also had would crank but not start.

grogg1256

ok--i keep reading about passlock--and im wondering if this hasnt been the problem all along. the only catch is there is no spark. he has seen the security light, i never have, but he uses the spare key and he started driving my car to work a month or so ago cuz of gas, so its seeing his key alot more then mine. the battery is on charge now and hes gonna try recoding it, and if that doesnt help, hes gonna change the ignition switch. so maybe today??hopefully--

BUDFAN8

i believe the security system on that car kills the fire to the plugs. its easy and free to try to reset the security system so i think that would be a good place to start.

Bud.

Whitetail Crazy

Sounds like the problem. Just turn the key to the run position and leave it for a while (usually 10 minutes). Security light should go from blinking to steady and car should start. Hope this is all it is.
Then take and by-pass the stupid system!!!!!

grogg1256

well--still nothing--when the key is in the on position, it just stays lit, no blinking--and he left it for 20 minutes and it never went out. he replaced the ignition switch, and still nothing--it just stays on, and the car just cranks....
tried where you put it into nuetral and that didnt work either
anymore ideas????

wrench97

Has he tried both keys?(yours and his)
How many coil packs does this car have?
Which motor is in the car?

grogg1256

its v6 3.1 L--it has 3 coil packs so he doesnt think all 3 could have gone out at the same time. the power stops at the ignition control module--bot th the old and new one he installed monday. and he tried both keys. he checked all the fuses..and he wants to know if there is anyway to splice wires and bypass the passlock system without having the car running.

and one other thing--the lights had been dimming--i never drive at night, so i didnt know that!!!

wrench97

The passlock is controlled by the chip in the key if its the factory alarm system,
When you turn the key on does the check engine light come on?
With newer cars the ECM controls the ignition module you can't check the module with a test light because the ECM sends and receives .5v signals and when you probe the wire
with a test light you can do more damage than good.
So anyway if there is no Check Engine light with the key on check the 5 amp fuse in the fuse box.

grogg1256

hes using an ohm meter-- i dont know if that makes a difference or not. whats the correct way to reset the computer???? im sure i can do that myself, hes frustrated and maybe he aint doing it right...i really dont know.. i cant pick with anything at the moment, but after the kids are in bed, ill let you know exactly what lights are on when. this is a whole new way to be go-fer ...

wrench97

I'm not sure how to reset the passkey system with out the GM scan tool, it may be in the owners manual that kind thing is hard to find published anywhere it kind of defeats the purpose of the system if they put out an easy way to defeat it.
But I would check to see if their any fuses blown first.

Raylo

Here is the bypass diagram for PassKey II. I'm not sure but it might be similar to the later PassLock. But you should have a flashing or steady "Security" light if you have a problem with this system. Flashing is a legit security issue(wrong key) and steady is fail safe. In any case the PassKey II killed the fuel injectors I believe and not the ignition.... I think. As many problems as there are with this system TSF should do an authoritative sticky on the subject.

BTW, I used this diagram and successfully bypassed the PassKey II on m y1994 Camaro with a Radio Shack resistor. Mine was in fail safe (steady security light) due to a key cylinder contact failure while the motor was running so it would start OK. I just had to get rid of the light.

This site also has a table of PassKey II resistances. But you need to actually test the key and the new resistor with the same me.ter since many meters are just not that precise to compare to real rated resistances on resistor packaging.

http://shbox.com/1/vats_bypass.jpg

http://shbox.com/1/4th_gen_tech2.html#pass_key

grogg1256

thank you very much for the diagrams--ill save them for him and let him compare--i can bleed brakes and spot a socket, but thats beyond me. i have found so many articles about the passlock that pretty much makes everything wrong with your car a result of the passlock..and i cant find any "official" information on it anywhere--which is understandable, but irritating.


ok--when i turn the key to start--all the dummy lights come on--but there is no dome light when i opened the door, just the one on the floor--when i switched it to on from start, i got the oil, battery and check engine. then i turned it completely off, then back to the on without cranking it--then i got oil, battery, check engine, and a steady security light.

what about the actually computer??? hes installed 3 new components--the icm, the ignition switch and the crank positioning sensor--does it need to relearn that?? and can it learn it without the dealer??

mack1

Hi grogg1256,

Without the scan tool, you can reset the computer error codes by removing the battery cable, then reconnecting it. That may not work for alarm systems, but it will for check engine light, and some of those. Your husband can try that to see.

Have him sit and talk while you type. Make sure he knows we are all gearheads and he among friends. We don't all type well either. Some of us know about alarm systems (I am not one of them) and can probable help him.

Have a nice day.

Best regards,
Mack1

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Raylo

Based on what I have seen you post I really don't think you have a PassLock issue. If the Security light was flashing that would mean PassLock was preventing your car from starting. If the car was running and the Security light was on steady that would mean it is in fail safe. The lights you report "on" with the ignition key on seem normal. They would go out once (if) the car