It is time to do some painting, Need some good advice folks

**Direct Current** · 08-24-2006, 10:23 PM

Quote:

Hay Folks, need some goody advice!

I have decided to paint me old 85 Toyota Pick-me-up truck. I am planting to do some ukneek designing on the body to make it my on design toy. In other words, I am going to have some fun and relax and do it myself.

I am a fairly good hobbyshop workshopest but I need some step details on painting process. So ordeer in the court,here comes the questions, I hope you can answer?

Step 1. What do I need to do to prepare the existing boby paint For painting? ((What kind of chemicals to use/ sanding/ sealant and primer paint, etc.)

Step 2. What type of repair putty should I use for rusted spots? (( fiberglass or Bondo, type of rust stoper,etc. ))

Step 3. What Type of paint should I use (( I plant to place multiple layer of pant on it for mirror look appearance*Make all you folks with fords and chevs invious *, main paint, finish coat,etc.))

Can you all give me some step by step out line of process, like 1. sand it down with no.2 sanding paper, 2. sand down with fine sanding paper, 3. place primer coat down. and right on down to finish, etc..

I know am asking a lot but I would truly welcome and be forever thankfull for the help before starting.

God bless all and have the greatest day, month and life you can have.

Spacemonkey6401 · 08-25-2006, 05:30 PM

First, I hope you understand that this is a very loaded question, and there are many, many different ways to attack it. I'll give you my advice, tips, and tricks, but there are other ways to do these things. I've been painting "shade tree" for about 8 years now, doing local jobs, just like you describe, for way less than a body shop could charge.

You have to know what kind of a job your shooting for in the first place, quick and easy to sell it, something that will last two to five years, or if you plan on taking it to the grave with you. That decsion dictates how you decide what materials and how you will repair the rust, dents and dings.

1.) To prepare the body for paint you need to sand it all down. I usually go with 180 sand paper on a DA, or inline sander. The da works great, but can make dips. If you have scratches in the orginal paint, you need to take it down to the metal or where ever the scratch ends, if the scratch goes to primer, go to the primer, then in the area around it feather it in with 220 or 320.

2.) By using the inline sander you should see where you have divits, dents, and of course you know where your rust is. The rule of thumb I follow is if the dent or spot that needs filler is more than 1/4 in deep, put fiberglass in it, bondo will crack out over time. This relates to how good of a job you want to do, if you want you can just slap mud over the whole thing, sand it smooth, paint it and call it good.

If you have a ton of hail dings in the hood, consider buying a new one, the time it takes you and the body filler you put it are more expensive than buying a new one. You can look for aftermarket for it, or you can go Toyota orginal, aftermarket usually take a little more adjustment of your fenders and everything, but will save you time in the long run.

If the front fenders are rusted out, consider buying replacements. I know for a Chevy/ford replacement fenders run from 75 for older ones to 125 for the newer ones. Factory ones cost more, but once again line up better than the aftermarket.

All rust must be removed, sanded off, or at the extreme cut out-be careful not to warp the metal, unless you have a plasma cutter handy. Spraying primer over rust will do nothing but hide it for awhile, but then again, if you are selling it, it doesn't matter.

As far as types of fiberglass, I personally use Kittyhair. It's got the fiberglass already mixed up with resin, and all you have to do is put in the hardner.

With fiberglass you want to get it close, but not perfect. You want to lay a thin layer of mud over the top of it, that way you can get a seamless transition between the metal and the filler. With the fiberglass I usually use 80 grit sandpaper to sand that down, and then once I get to the stage of putting the mud on, sand it with the 180 till it's close, then 220 or 320, to feather it all in.

Once all the body work is done, it's time to prime. First you want to wipe the whole thing down with a degreaser/dirt remover. Make sure the degreaser you choose will work with the primer you choose. There are very many different types of primer i.e. acrylic enamel, urethane, etc. on the market, whatever primer you do choose make sure it will work with your paint. Different primers can have different reactions with the paint. I normally don't use a sealer unless the primer has some sort of weird reaction with the metal. But I also use a primer with a sealer in it. It's happened a couple of times, the primer bubbled, or had weird spider like web that was raised, in both instances a sealer took care of the problem.

Let the remover dry and then tack the surface of everything.

While priming, make sure you allow the right flash times-time between coats. One thing with primer you have to remember is you can always sand it off, spraying your primer makes great practice for you paint. After you get it primed to get the look your going after, it's time to prep for paint.

Note: After priming, you should be able to see how good your body work is. If there is anything you need to fix, if you have any lips in your mud, a dent shows up that you didn't see, anything like that, it's time to do it. Rework the area you need to, and reprime the area. For example, if the hood has dings, fix the hood dings, reprime the hood, don't need to do the whole truck. If you do have problems, go ahead and use the 220/180 to fix it.

Once all the primer is down, you can either use a scuff pad, or use 600 grit and wet sand for a smooth finish. Do not use the da or inline, use a block sander and your hand. Make sure everything gets scuffed up good, so the paint has something to stick to.

Then it's time to paint. To get the really glossy look your going after, you want to use a base coat clear coat paint. Spray down your base coat, usually about three light coats, allowing recommended flash time, and then spray your clear coat. After getting a good layer of clear on it, this is where your mirror finish comes into play. Wet sand 600 grit the first couple, then 1200, the clear coat, let it dry, tack it, and spray another coat of clear. Repeat until you get the glossy look your going after. Pat yourself on the back.

I use Kittyhair fiberglass, no messing with the fiberglass pads, resin and hardner, trying to mix it all together, and everything. Take out the amount you need, add hardner and put it on.

I use Autozone mud, it's cheap, and works great.

For pinholes or for fine feathering, use glazing putty, you can get that at the autobody shop.

For primer, I use the Dupont recommended for Imeron. It's also a sealer in itself, and takes hardner to mix up.

For paint, I use Dupont Imeron. It's one of the most expensive paints, but will last far longer than anything else. Shermin Williams makes a top of the line really good paint too.

You can use whatever paint/primer you want, just make sure they work together, and remember with paint you really get what you pay for. Don't be afraid of asking your local paint dealer, they want to make you happy, and hope to have your business again. Your spending a lot of money on paint and primer, and they want you to come back.

Tips/Tricks
Watch your temperature. The hardner and reducer you use varies with the temp you are painting at. Also remember if your heating your shop, which right now isn't a problem, but in the winter, just because your heating your shop and it says 75, the metal takes time to warm up to that 75. Also, if your shop is at 80, it's a 110 degree day and you pull it into the shop to paint, your metal is at that temp. Let the truck set at that temp.

If you buy replacement fenders/hood, you can just scuff them with the scuff pad, or sand them with the 600. You don't necessarly have to prime them, but you can, and should.

Make sure to scuff/sand primer.

Chain your truck down, static electricity attracts dirt.

This is all I can think of right now, if I think of anything else, I'll post it. If you have any questions, ask.

**Direct Current** · 08-26-2006, 01:35 AM

Quote:

Hello Space monkey6401, I-I-I do not know what to say Thanks and Blessings are not enough for this!!! I am totally amazed and without words. Beside folks from KS where great people, been there several times working on CNC welding and cutting equipment for ESAB, Built me a very good Plasma machine out of fire sales parts they had and modified it a bit to get a plasma/ tig/mig/stick welder., wanted a CNC but couldn't come up with the 5 million to buy .

You should write a book on this stuff, what some 30 car shop book I have scan at the book store could not' explain in 200 page booklets. "WOW. If some on this forum had an award program, you should get one.

After reading this, I did not reallize how close body painting and working with metal(cars that is, not girls which would be more then fun but like there is 10 men to every women in this area according to troy State UNIV. ) is to working with fine wood working, which I do. I printed out you info. I have nearly all the tools for the job. I may have to get another hood but that was part of the mod any way. Going to buid the inside of the cab to look like a copit of a hellicopter,also going to be extending a bit ( at one time I thought making a hellicopter out of it, Had a lic to flight at one time.) I am going to replace the bed and if I can get a replaement bed and fenders altogether with a two foot extention. going for a midnight purple maybe a bit of pin design gold and copper. going to rebuild the tran, the eng is fine but I've got a little design I have for better gas milage.

So what do you think? ( You think I should go ahead and add the foldout props and a tail fan) First I have to work up some money which is come in a book I wrote (SIFI, nothning to do with this stuff, I leave that to you my friend) and publish my self.

Again many thanks, and don't worry I will, with out a dought, be asking for some advice. God bless God Bless everyone on the forum.

OctoberRust · 08-26-2006, 11:52 AM

As far as sanding it down, there is these things called SandBlasters, and what they do is shoot sand out at a rapid pace, and can really help with clearing away all the paint at a fast pace, be very careful with these though because you have to know where to stop, I usually go threw the finish coat, and the paint, and once I get to the primer, I stop and sand the rest away with the above specifications.

As far as paint goes, I always choose House of Kolor paint, because they have a wide variety and come fairly cheap, and could last you a long time.
http://www.houseofkolor.com/hok/index.jsp

08-25-2006, 05:30 PM	#2 (permalink)
Spacemonkey6401 Registered User Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: KS, US Posts: 47 OS: Win XP	First, I hope you understand that this is a very loaded question, and there are many, many different ways to attack it. I'll give you my advice, tips, and tricks, but there are other ways to do these things. I've been painting "shade tree" for about 8 years now, doing local jobs, just like you describe, for way less than a body shop could charge. You have to know what kind of a job your shooting for in the first place, quick and easy to sell it, something that will last two to five years, or if you plan on taking it to the grave with you. That decsion dictates how you decide what materials and how you will repair the rust, dents and dings. 1.) To prepare the body for paint you need to sand it all down. I usually go with 180 sand paper on a DA, or inline sander. The da works great, but can make dips. If you have scratches in the orginal paint, you need to take it down to the metal or where ever the scratch ends, if the scratch goes to primer, go to the primer, then in the area around it feather it in with 220 or 320. 2.) By using the inline sander you should see where you have divits, dents, and of course you know where your rust is. The rule of thumb I follow is if the dent or spot that needs filler is more than 1/4 in deep, put fiberglass in it, bondo will crack out over time. This relates to how good of a job you want to do, if you want you can just slap mud over the whole thing, sand it smooth, paint it and call it good. If you have a ton of hail dings in the hood, consider buying a new one, the time it takes you and the body filler you put it are more expensive than buying a new one. You can look for aftermarket for it, or you can go Toyota orginal, aftermarket usually take a little more adjustment of your fenders and everything, but will save you time in the long run. If the front fenders are rusted out, consider buying replacements. I know for a Chevy/ford replacement fenders run from 75 for older ones to 125 for the newer ones. Factory ones cost more, but once again line up better than the aftermarket. All rust must be removed, sanded off, or at the extreme cut out-be careful not to warp the metal, unless you have a plasma cutter handy. Spraying primer over rust will do nothing but hide it for awhile, but then again, if you are selling it, it doesn't matter. As far as types of fiberglass, I personally use Kittyhair. It's got the fiberglass already mixed up with resin, and all you have to do is put in the hardner. With fiberglass you want to get it close, but not perfect. You want to lay a thin layer of mud over the top of it, that way you can get a seamless transition between the metal and the filler. With the fiberglass I usually use 80 grit sandpaper to sand that down, and then once I get to the stage of putting the mud on, sand it with the 180 till it's close, then 220 or 320, to feather it all in. Once all the body work is done, it's time to prime. First you want to wipe the whole thing down with a degreaser/dirt remover. Make sure the degreaser you choose will work with the primer you choose. There are very many different types of primer i.e. acrylic enamel, urethane, etc. on the market, whatever primer you do choose make sure it will work with your paint. Different primers can have different reactions with the paint. I normally don't use a sealer unless the primer has some sort of weird reaction with the metal. But I also use a primer with a sealer in it. It's happened a couple of times, the primer bubbled, or had weird spider like web that was raised, in both instances a sealer took care of the problem. Let the remover dry and then tack the surface of everything. While priming, make sure you allow the right flash times-time between coats. One thing with primer you have to remember is you can always sand it off, spraying your primer makes great practice for you paint. After you get it primed to get the look your going after, it's time to prep for paint. Note: After priming, you should be able to see how good your body work is. If there is anything you need to fix, if you have any lips in your mud, a dent shows up that you didn't see, anything like that, it's time to do it. Rework the area you need to, and reprime the area. For example, if the hood has dings, fix the hood dings, reprime the hood, don't need to do the whole truck. If you do have problems, go ahead and use the 220/180 to fix it. Once all the primer is down, you can either use a scuff pad, or use 600 grit and wet sand for a smooth finish. Do not use the da or inline, use a block sander and your hand. Make sure everything gets scuffed up good, so the paint has something to stick to. Then it's time to paint. To get the really glossy look your going after, you want to use a base coat clear coat paint. Spray down your base coat, usually about three light coats, allowing recommended flash time, and then spray your clear coat. After getting a good layer of clear on it, this is where your mirror finish comes into play. Wet sand 600 grit the first couple, then 1200, the clear coat, let it dry, tack it, and spray another coat of clear. Repeat until you get the glossy look your going after. Pat yourself on the back. I use Kittyhair fiberglass, no messing with the fiberglass pads, resin and hardner, trying to mix it all together, and everything. Take out the amount you need, add hardner and put it on. I use Autozone mud, it's cheap, and works great. For pinholes or for fine feathering, use glazing putty, you can get that at the autobody shop. For primer, I use the Dupont recommended for Imeron. It's also a sealer in itself, and takes hardner to mix up. For paint, I use Dupont Imeron. It's one of the most expensive paints, but will last far longer than anything else. Shermin Williams makes a top of the line really good paint too. You can use whatever paint/primer you want, just make sure they work together, and remember with paint you really get what you pay for. Don't be afraid of asking your local paint dealer, they want to make you happy, and hope to have your business again. Your spending a lot of money on paint and primer, and they want you to come back. Tips/Tricks Watch your temperature. The hardner and reducer you use varies with the temp you are painting at. Also remember if your heating your shop, which right now isn't a problem, but in the winter, just because your heating your shop and it says 75, the metal takes time to warm up to that 75. Also, if your shop is at 80, it's a 110 degree day and you pull it into the shop to paint, your metal is at that temp. Let the truck set at that temp. If you buy replacement fenders/hood, you can just scuff them with the scuff pad, or sand them with the 600. You don't necessarly have to prime them, but you can, and should. Make sure to scuff/sand primer. Chain your truck down, static electricity attracts dirt. This is all I can think of right now, if I think of anything else, I'll post it. If you have any questions, ask. Last edited by Spacemonkey6401; 08-25-2006 at 05:49 PM.

08-26-2006, 11:52 AM	#4 (permalink)
OctoberRust Registered User Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Russia Posts: 75 OS: Windows XP SP2 My System	As far as sanding it down, there is these things called SandBlasters, and what they do is shoot sand out at a rapid pace, and can really help with clearing away all the paint at a fast pace, be very careful with these though because you have to know where to stop, I usually go threw the finish coat, and the paint, and once I get to the primer, I stop and sand the rest away with the above specifications. As far as paint goes, I always choose House of Kolor paint, because they have a wide variety and come fairly cheap, and could last you a long time. http://www.houseofkolor.com/hok/index.jsp